Childhood Vaccinations – Necessary or Overkill?

So, what you are saying is that you don't know and are unwilling to research the question I asked, which was:

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There's a natural remedy for every thinkable disease and ailment, either efficient in prevention or treatment of disease.

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That is demonstrably not true.

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However with herbs, vitamins and minerals, the chance of serious problems from the nature products is very small.

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Why do you think that, buz? What makes you think that the side effects for herbs are fewer or even not more numerous than those of synthetics?Like another mentioned, the reason we use commercial aspirin now is because the willow bark extract that aspirin was originally made from used to make people's stomachs bleed quite frequently.Commercial aspirin is, by law, consistent in purity and potentcy and it's side effects have been researched to death, while willow bark extract can cause terrible stomach pain and hemmorage.In fact, the the herbal drugs you have taken are likely to have hundreds or thousands of chemical compounds that might be affecting your body in unknown ways, simply because the company who manufactures them has ever been made to indentify what is in the drugs and make sure there are no dangerous compounds in them.Haven't you been reading anything I and others have written in this thread?

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A lot of factors and personal experience go into my decisions. I could be wrong and I could die tomorrow, but that is a risk.

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I can trust the doctor and I could also die tomorrow, but that is a risk.

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We all choose the risks we are willing to take.

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That's true, but based upon what you have written in this thread, I honestly do not think that you truly understand the magnitude of the lack of information on these herbal drugs.The information simply doesn't exist to know enough for anyone to make an informed decision about most of them.Edited by schrafinator, : No reason given.

So, are you saying that when penicillin and sulfa drugs were discovered, it was a bad thing?

Mangosteen.For osteoarthritis.Edited by schrafinator, : No reason given.

What I's also like is a response to these points that I raised in my last message.

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There's a natural remedy for every thinkable disease and ailment, either efficient in prevention or treatment of disease.

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That is demonstrably not true.

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However with herbs, vitamins and minerals, the chance of serious problems from the nature products is very small.

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Why do you think that, buz? What makes you think that the side effects for herbs are fewer or even not more numerous than those of synthetics?Like another mentioned, the reason we use commercial aspirin now is because the willow bark extract that aspirin was originally made from used to make people's stomachs bleed quite frequently.Commercial aspirin is, by law, consistent in purity and potentcy and it's side effects have been researched to death, while willow bark extract can cause terrible stomach pain and hemmorage.In fact, the the herbal drugs you have taken are likely to have hundreds or thousands of chemical compounds that might be affecting your body in unknown ways, simply because the company who manufactures them has ever been made to indentify what is in the drugs and make sure there are no dangerous compounds in them.Haven't you been reading anything I and others have written in this thread?

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Herbs do not make money for the practitioners nor the pharmaceuticals.

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Buz, how naive can you be?Herbs make fabulous amounts of money for the herbalists and naturopaths, and for the manufacurers.In fact, the profits enjoyed are huge considering that they do not have the considerable burden that the drug companies have of demonstrating that their products are effective and safe.The largely unregulated herbal drug industry is a multi-billion dollar industry with little regulation nor oversight.If you are going to look with a wary eye at the conventional medical and pharmeceutical industries than you should do exactly the same for the herbal drug industry, since the latter is just as money-driven as the former.

Quackwatch doesn't mention that the juice is used for arthritis, but said that the dried and powdered skin was the most commonly used version of mangosteen.What if your naturopath prescribed powdered mangosteen skin?Here are the flaws in your reasoning:

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There doesn't seem to be any danger in it

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We actually do not know if there is any danger in it or not, since it hasn't been tested. We also do not know if it is effective for osteoarthritis, interferes with any other drugs or foods, what the active ingredients are, or, if it is effective, what amounts of it should be ingested.

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So given all that, if I had osteoarthritis and I drank mangosteen (and actually liked the taste) and it stopped the pain; I would continue to drink it.

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Unless you were in a carefully controlled clinical experimental situation, you would have no way of knowing if the mangosteen was the reason that your pain stopped or was reduced, so it would be an error to say that it has any effect.Pain is one of those things that is very subject to the placebo effect.

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I've never claimed that anything natural is automatically good for you. I'm quite aware that there are poisonous plants and animals that aren't fit for consumption.

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Are you saying that the FDA allows these juices to be manufactured and sold in the U.S. for general consumption?

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The FDA "allowed" Ephedra to be manufactured and sold in the US and it killed people.Thats because there are far more requirements for fruit juice manufacturers to show that their product is safe than there are for herbal drug manufacturers to do the same.

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Do you know that about any other fruit juices you drink before you decide to drink them?

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If I was on any other medication, I would want to know that, yes.One should not drink juices high in potassium, for example, if one is taking diuretics.There are a whole host of known prescription drug and food interactions, many of which can be viewed here.The reason we know about all of these interactions is because the companies that manufacture them found out about them during the clinical trials and tests that they are required to do before releasing them to the public.How many food and herbal drug interactions do your naturopathic sources know about?

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Anyone taking multiple medications, herbs, supplements, etc. should always do their homework. There is a book called: Vitamins, Herbs, Minerals, & Supplements; The Complete Guide by H. Winter Griffith, M.D. 1998. It includes known interactions, usage information, warnings, known effects, etc.

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How do the effects become "known"? In the case of medicinal herbs, it is certainly not by any investigation done by the companies who make them.

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But did the manufacturer of the fruit juice do that research or the diuretic manufacturer?

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Probably the diuretic maker.How many of your herbal medication's manufacturers have done such research? [qs]The reason we know about all of these interactions is because the companies that manufacture them found out about them during the clinical trials and tests that they are required to do before releasing them to the public.[/quote]

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You haven't shown me that a fruit juice manufacturer is required to do testing to show how his fruit juice may interact with various drugs.

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That's true, they do not probably have to do that.What about the Mangosteen skin?

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BTW, Xango has been warned by the FDA about outrageous claims.

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Yeah, it's too bad that the FDA has no power to do more than that.

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That's like asking how many food and drug interactions does my doctor know about.

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she probably knows quite a few, and specialists likely know even more.

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It is usually the pharmacist that tells you about interactions, not the doctor.

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Then maybe you need a different doctor?But anyway, since there is no "pharmacist" at the health food store or wherever you buy your hrebs, and since very few of the herbal drugs have been tested to know if they have any interactions, you are mostly shooting in the dark when you combine them.You can't make an informed decision when the information hasn't been gathered yet.

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Are you saying that no drug or food additive that the FDA allowed on the market has ever killed or maimed people? They have never had to reverse their approval?

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No, of course not.The point is, the FDA doesn't get to approve any herbal drugs, so it's a complete crap shoot to take them compared to the much more informed risk with prescription drugs.Policy Review | Fr die Gesellschaft von Vorteil PD, I just want to know if you think this situation is acceptable.

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unapproved new drug

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Herbal drugs are classified as "nutritional supplements" precisely so they can get around all of the laws that regulate drugs.

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As I've said before change takes time.

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If the money is too good, change can be delayed indefinitely.

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It took time for the drug rules to get where they are today and it will take time for the herbal rules to get to a standard people can accept.

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That's crap, pd.Herbal drugs are drugs! There is no reason in the world that they aren't being regulated as drugs today other than the vigorous lobbying by the manufacturers and the health food stores.That law I mentioned in my last message could be repealed in a single vote, and in fact, never should have been instituted in the first place.I ask again; do you find this situation with the regulations to be acceptable?Edited by schrafinator, : No reason given.

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But I don't want to lose the right to choose them as my choice for health maintenance and healing.

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We shouldn't be allowed to choose to buy or sell drugs that are untested for safety and efficacy.If you want to use a given herbal drug, even though after it has been thoroughly researched and it has been found to have no theraputic benefit (like Echenacia), then you can grow it yourself and use it to yor hearts content.But it should not be bought or sold.The ability to sell and buy snake oil is not in the public's interest.Sometimes, people need to be protected from those companies that will take advantage of their discontent with the limitations of science and conventional medicine.Edited by schrafinator, : No reason given.Edited by schrafinator, : No reason given.Edited by schrafinator, : No reason given.

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Antibiotics increase the growth of the yeast Candida albicans in the gut, Noverr explains. It is a common side effect of antibiotic use and previous studies show that this change in the gut could increase allergies.

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How is this a danger to one's immune system?

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Antibiotics increase the growth of the yeast Candida albicans in the gut, Noverr explains. It is a common side effect of antibiotic use and previous studies show that this change in the gut could increase allergies.

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Well, the statement says that the studies show that Candida yeast in the gut could increase allergies, not that it does.That sounds to me like tenuous support of the claim at best.

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Oral Candida or Thrush ...It often heralds a decrease in the strength of the immune system.

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"Heralds" means that the appearance of Candida is a sign or symptom that the immune system is weakened, not that Candida actively weakens the immune system.

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Candida can weaken the immune sytem.

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Actually, the site states that chronic candidiasis weakens the immune system. An occasional imbalance of the gut bacteria as a result of antibiotics that results in a few days or weeks of increased candida in the gut is not at all the same as a chronic yeast infection.Most people who take antibiotics properly do not get candidiasis.So, I would conclude that the claim that antibiotics are a danger to the immune system is not terribly accurate.Edited by schrafinator, : No reason given.