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Author | Topic: Christianity and the End Times | |||||||||||||||||||||||
jaywill Member (Idle past 1970 days) Posts: 4519 From: VA USA Joined: |
quote: I feel equally free to ask the question right here. Thanks anyway. Don't be such a flaming hypocrite. This thread is on the End Times. You've been hijacking it to be about the Beginning Times and whatever else you can complain about in the Bible. Edited by jaywill, : No reason given. Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.
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jar Member (Idle past 423 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
jaywill writes: Am I misrepresenting you to teach that the champion of the truth in the account is not God but the serpent ? In Genesis 2&3, yes, in that story the God lies and the snake tells the truth.
jaywill writes: So your hero in the account is the serpent. Why am I not surprised? Bullshit, there is no hero in the story found in Genesis 2&3. Have you ever even read Genesis 2&3?
jaywill writes: Since you're here to "help" people understand the Bible what did it mean for Jesus to say Let the dead bury their own dead. (Luke 9:60) ? He implies that though some men's hearts are beating and lungs are breathing and souls are active, they are on some level DEAD ? And so once again you try to change the subject.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Why are you so hard on your opponent? You come across as having no respect for the man at all? Even politicians who don't respect the ideologies of their opponents at least appear to be polite when being interviewed on live TV in the presence of their opponents! sheesh!
Now answer these questions, as they are on topic:
jaywill, asking jar writes: Since you're here to "help" people understand the Bible what did it mean for Jesus to say Let the dead bury their own dead. (Luke 9:60) ? I have another one, while we are all discussing these things.....In the context of this exchange: John18:33-40 ESV writes: 33So Pilate entered his headquarters again and called Jesus and said to him, Are you the King of the Jews? 34Jesus answered, Do you say this of your own accord, or did others say it to you about me? 35Pilate answered, Am I a Jew? Your own nation and the chief priests have delivered you over to me. What have you done? 36Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would have been fighting, that I might not be delivered over to the Jews. But my kingdom is not from the world. 37Then Pilate said to him, So you are a king? Jesus answered, You say that I am a king. For this purpose I was born and for this purpose I have come into the worldto bear witness to the truth. Everyone who is of the truth listens to my voice. 38Pilate said to him, What is truth? After he had said this, he went back outside to the Jews and told them, I find no guilt in him. 39But you have a custom that I should release one man for you at the Passover. So do you want me to release to you the King of the Jews? 40They cried out again, Not this man, but Barabbas! Now Barabbas was a robber. What specifically would the character Pilate, in the book, mean? Edited by Phat, : No reason given.Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
I've been trying to make that point to you for years. What specifically would the character Pilate, in the book, mean? Jesus said,"For this purpose I was born and for this purpose I have come into the worldto bear witness to the truth." He came to bear witness to the truth. He wasn't the truth Himself. What He said was the truth.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Evidently, Pilate didn't understand either...though he was honest enough to declare to the Jews that Jesus was innocent! Do you think that Pilate did understand?
Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Jaywill writes:
I know the thread has diverged from the topic from time to time. That's why I don't want to deliberately take it farther off topic. Don't be such a flaming hypocrite. This thread is on the End Times. You've been hijacking it to be about the Beginning Times and whatever else you can complain about in the Bible. Are you afraid of your own challenge? Go ahead and start a thread on John 1 and we'll see what happens.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Additionally, John 14:5 makes a case that the messenger was, in fact, the message:
Lord, said Thomas, we do not know where You are going, so how can we know the way? 6Jesus answered, I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. 7If you had known Me, you would know My Father as well. From now on you do know Him and have seen Him. Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
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PaulK Member Posts: 17828 Joined: Member Rating: 2.3 |
quote: Oh please. Even Hal Lindsey’s request for donations - prominent on his website talks about sharing the Gospels. And just like you he was promoting his own view of Biblical prophecy.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
It appears that you get angry when people won't discuss a topic the way that you want it to be framed. The reality is that in debates, both sides have an opportunity to frame the debate without prejudice. Why not answer his question? Would you prefer that he go down your rabbit trail before you go down his, or do you have no intention of granting him that basic respect?
Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
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jar Member (Idle past 423 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: Why are you so hard on your opponent? You come across as having no respect for the man at all? I have no respect for those perverting the Bible and Christianity.
Phat writes: I have another one, while we are all discussing these things.....In the context of this exchange: John18:33-40 ESV writes: 33So Pilate entered his headquarters again and called Jesus and said to him, Are you the King of the Jews? 34Jesus answered, Do you say this of your own accord, or did others say it to you about me? 35Pilate answered, Am I a Jew? Your own nation and the chief priests have delivered you over to me. What have you done? 36Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would have been fighting, that I might not be delivered over to the Jews. But my kingdom is not from the world. 37Then Pilate said to him, So you are a king? Jesus answered, You say that I am a king. For this purpose I was born and for this purpose I have come into the worldto bear witness to the truth. Everyone who is of the truth listens to my voice. 38Pilate said to him, What is truth? After he had said this, he went back outside to the Jews and told them, I find no guilt in him. 39But you have a custom that I should release one man for you at the Passover. So do you want me to release to you the King of the Jews? 40They cried out again, Not this man, but Barabbas! Now Barabbas was a robber. What specifically would the character Pilate, in the book, mean? What does that have to do with the topic Phat? With you I get the feeling you simply can't follow a topic rather than intentionally try to change the topic so let's try to follow this subject. What does any of that have to do with Christianity and the End Times?
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Innocent of what? Jesus was accused of claiming to be King of the Jews. Apparently Pilate didn't believe that He had confessed. Evidently, Pilate didn't understand either...though he was honest enough to declare to the Jews that Jesus was innocent!And our geese will blot out the sun.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
To the peanut gallery:
I would argue that all of this is on topic in that until it can be established that there is or is not an end time approaching theologically, humanity must deal with the basic issues regarding religion, belief, truth, and consensus. Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo |
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jar Member (Idle past 423 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: It appears that you get angry when people won't discuss a topic the way that you want it to be framed. The reality is that in debates, both sides have an opportunity to frame the debate without prejudice. Why not answer his question? Would you prefer that he go down your rabbit trail before you go down his, or do you have no intention of granting him that basic respect? I have no respect for snake oil salesmen. It is not that I want people to discuss the topic in some particular way but they should try to address the topic rather than try to misdirect the audience attention and hope no one notices they changed the topic. And I certainly don't get angry; no one here is sufficient to make me angry. I do try to point out when attempts are made to sell snake oil though. For example, look at the sub-title and the try to find anywhere that I championed the serpent.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
jar writes:
Some critics would argue that your whole rabbit trail of declaring that the snake tells the truth and that God lies is perverting the Bible. Yet we respectfully give you the platform even though you insult our intelligence.
I have no respect for those perverting the Bible and Christianity. What does any of that have to do with Christianity and the End Times? It establishes who said it...whether it was actually God talking through human authors or whether it is simply a product of human imagination. If it is the former, we may well pay attention to end times possibilities. If it is the latter, we still need to be responsible, yet not so religious.Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
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jar Member (Idle past 423 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: jar writes: It establishes who said it...whether it was actually God talking through human authors or whether it is simply a product of human imagination. If it is the former, we may well pay attention to end times possibilities. If it is the latter, we still need to be responsible, yet not so religious. What does any of that have to do with Christianity and the End Times? HUH? Where do you get anything like that from what you quoted from John 18?
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