Another Test for Intelligent Design Proponents

Science would argue for figure 2, increase in entropy (chaos) in the nature of the physical universe over time. Patterns in nature suggest a designer because of the way everything fits together. The way carbon atoms have 4 electrons to bond, how everything is just amazingly PERFECT for human life on earth. A designer seems a sensible conclusion because of the lives we are born into, and what we see in nature, ideas and thoughts about a creator have been deduced not blindly, but through reason in places where they do not live like I. I do not see an increase in entropy over time, I see order in nature. I have asked my biology teacher about it, he told me that although we can see many examples of order here, on a cosmic scale we see increase in chaos. Would not evolution itself be example of Increase in order? Someone tell me the truth.I don't really buy entropy.I do believe in a God though. Creation.

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Your body may be gone, I'm gonna carry you in.
In my head, in my heart, in my soul.
And maybe we'll get lucky and we'll both live again.
Well I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Don't think so.

So the increase of energy used to counter entropy is it huh, yeah ok, forgot about that.

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The old man cries in the sorrow of eternity.

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namely to tell us of each figure whether or not they think it shows the hallmarks of design, perhaps accompanied by an explanation of their reasoning.

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To answer this question, one would probably have to understand the intricate workings of the universe in it's entirety.Could you explain the graphs?Why not this? Or this?

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The old man cries in the sorrow of eternity.

I dont get this thread, is there a point to it? the graphs dont relate to anything, and nothing is making sense. The title annoys me sort of, so I keep looking at this startrekkie's face with my tongue stuck out.

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"The old man cries in the sorrow of eternity." Van Gogh

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Can you state what this "theory" is? And what the falsification test for it is? Just curious, as people seem to have a lot of different definitions.

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Jaywill must be the man in the cave who gained freedom, came back and recieved comments such as yours. You deny a God because of your studies in science and mathematics. God is beyond what information you have spent your days and nights, probably enjoying to read about. Nothing from your studies can give you an education about anything of God, because God is not of this world, and this world has seemingly trapped you into seeing only it, seeing only the physicalities of the earth. Well please burst the heart-shaped box. Step out of your comfortable evidence ridden science weekly journal reading community who think they know about life. Because these people are lost, and they do not know of God past reasoning used to study data gathered through observable experiments in nature and in labs.

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Argument from incredulity.

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Why? Because he sees that in nature there is order, there is life, there is a world perfectly designed for humans? Incredulity, because he stands up against thousands of minds who study the laws of nature? Your scanty reply is embarrassing because you don't care about it. You simply state that there are many who disagree with you, therefore you are wrong, but I'm not going to take my time and reply because I already understand the argument, and I could care less about this lone wolf named jaywill. I applaud jaywill for venturing into a jungle blanketed think with opposition in the form of physical evidence and scientific minds. ID isn't about proof, it's about experience, life, and God. He is simply trying to show you something, but you oppress him with claims that he is the one who is ignorant, that he is the one who believes the world is flat.

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Argument from ignorance.

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The only one here who is ignorant is you. Ignorant in the ways of God, because you can't see past the simple realm of observe and test.

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"The old man cries in the sorrow of eternity." Van Gogh

Fact is, it's another lame trap of some sort. It's para's posting style. She sets people up like dogs. It's really stoopid and however gratifying to her, is not productive for the growth of her mind. Spring it already, geez.

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"The old man cries in the sorrow of eternity." Van Gogh

Well, it seems that noone took a clear stance, and you had to spring it with explanation instead of questioning. I like it better that way I guess.

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"The old man cries in the sorrow of eternity." Van Gogh

It was a trap. She just sprung it.Fortunately noone took a stance.This message has been edited by prophex, 01-01-2006 06:55 PM

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"The old man cries in the sorrow of eternity." Van Gogh

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Again, this was another logical fallacy as used by Jaywill, where the argument is based on the ignorance of evidence that exists. Again, a logical fallacy doesn't mean that it is wrong, just that the argument presented does not have any validity and as such that it is irrelevant to whether or not it is right or wrong. In this case there is evidence to the contrary, so being ignorant of it while asserting a position that is contradicted by the evidence is rather foolish in a day and age when a little study will provide that information.

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This is exactly the type of thing my original post was about...

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ah, nope. the rest of your rant here is irrelevant. I always love it when someone tells me what I believe.

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It's the impression I got.Sorry about the post though. It was really messed up. I just get crazy when I see things like this. You know? It all goes back to Socrates. Whatever. I apologize.

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"The old man cries in the sorrow of eternity." Van Gogh

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The IDists rarely take a stance. And never a consistent one. THAT is the point.

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Intelligent is beyond two graphs, because what God has created is.

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"The old man cries in the sorrow of eternity." Van Gogh

Corruption
Original Sin
God's World Changed

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"The old man cries in the sorrow of eternity." Van Gogh

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Intelligent Design isn't religion, remember? It's "science".

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God is beyond science, how could it be about science?

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"The old man cries in the sorrow of eternity." Van Gogh

A seeming athiest tell me that I don't know of creation. That's funny.The science is the unimportant part of Creation. It doesn't even matter. I've told you guys about it all before.

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"The old man cries in the sorrow of eternity." Van Gogh

I don't think that you can prove God's existance scientifically. With reason, yes, with common sense, certainly. Knowing God is there, isn't really something that is meant to be debated about, it's a given.

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The little games which have transformed the world (for good and ill) in less than 5 centuries after millenia of religious belief left the world more or less unchanged from one century to the next.

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It's not even about religious belief, it's about God. It's about nothing else other than truth, and I find myself unable to express God.You can keep your little games.

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"The old man cries in the sorrow of eternity." Van Gogh

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And then, along comes Prophex, in a thread about intelligent design, saying that the Intelligent Designer is in fact the Christian God of creationism.

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I don't really know if I said that, but the main point was that Intelligent Design does not need science to be true, and that scientific evidence means nothing in the eyes of God, and those who realize that there is more to life than this earthly plight.

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"The old man cries in the sorrow of eternity." Van Gogh