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Thermodynamics

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Author Topic:   Thermodynamics
jar
Member (Idle past 423 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004

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Message 57 of 159 (185094)
02-14-2005 11:17 AM 		Reply to: Message 54 by Jordo86
02-14-2005 10:56 AM

Re: Stay on Track
Please let me ask you to consider this.
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Before a house is built it is very ordered. All the lumber is neatly stacked in a pile, the nails are boxed and sitting on shelves, the glass sits aside in a sheltered area. All the components are gathered together by kind, glass with glass, nail with nail, door with door, shingle with shingle.
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Bear with me, we will get to the 2nd. Law of Thermodynamics quickly.
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Do you agree so far? If not, why?
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Aslan is not a Tame Lion
This message is a reply to:
 Message 54 by Jordo86, posted 02-14-2005 10:56 AM Jordo86 has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 59 by Jordo86, posted 02-14-2005 11:30 AM jar has replied
  
jar
Member (Idle past 423 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004

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Message 60 of 159 (185102)
02-14-2005 11:34 AM 		Reply to: Message 59 by Jordo86
02-14-2005 11:30 AM

Re: Building Houses
Okay, we are together so far.
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Now is it true that the ordered state that exists becomes the disordered state that we call a house by applying energy in the form of workmen to take all the parts and put them in some newer, more complex form?
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Aslan is not a Tame Lion
This message is a reply to:
 Message 59 by Jordo86, posted 02-14-2005 11:30 AM Jordo86 has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 61 by Jordo86, posted 02-14-2005 11:42 AM jar has replied
  
jar
Member (Idle past 423 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004

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Message 64 of 159 (185109)
02-14-2005 11:53 AM 		Reply to: Message 61 by Jordo86
02-14-2005 11:42 AM

Re: Workmen
But, but, but, but...in the construction of a house these "workmen" are intelligent. Thats the difference. The way evolution works (in my opinion but you can convince me otherwise) in this situation would be to take out the workmen, and add something natural without intelligence behind it. Like the wind, or an earthquake.
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You're changing the goal posts here. We can deal with your questions about intellegence in a thread that deals with that.
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For now, let's stick with the house.
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Do you agree that the house is possible? Do you agree that the fact that a house exists does not violate the 2nd. Law of Thermodynamics?
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Aslan is not a Tame Lion
This message is a reply to:
 Message 61 by Jordo86, posted 02-14-2005 11:42 AM Jordo86 has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 65 by Jordo86, posted 02-14-2005 12:02 PM jar has replied
  
jar
Member (Idle past 423 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004

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Message 66 of 159 (185113)
02-14-2005 12:14 PM 		Reply to: Message 65 by Jordo86
02-14-2005 12:02 PM

Re: Workmen
In your OP you asked:
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How does the theory of evolution get around the 2nd law of thermodynamics? (The law that the universe is moving from order to disorder)
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That is all that we are dealing with in that thread. The topic of ID (Inept Design) is another subject and should be discussed in the Inept Design forum. For now let's try to answer your original question.
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Now you seem to be agreeing that the creation of the house does not violate the 2nd. Law of Thermodynamics.
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Jordo86 writes:
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Yes i beleive the house is possible. And no i dont think this in itself is a violation of the law
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Do you agree that the reason it does not violate the 2 Law of Thermodynamics is because energy from an outside source is available?
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Aslan is not a Tame Lion
This message is a reply to:
 Message 65 by Jordo86, posted 02-14-2005 12:02 PM Jordo86 has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 67 by Jordo86, posted 02-14-2005 12:23 PM jar has replied
  
jar
Member (Idle past 423 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004

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Message 68 of 159 (185117)
02-14-2005 12:32 PM 		Reply to: Message 67 by Jordo86
02-14-2005 12:23 PM

Re: Workmen
Where did the energy come from to build the house?
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Remember, the 2 Law of Thermodynamics ONLY deals with energy transfer, nothing else.
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Aslan is not a Tame Lion
This message is a reply to:
 Message 67 by Jordo86, posted 02-14-2005 12:23 PM Jordo86 has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 69 by Jordo86, posted 02-14-2005 12:35 PM jar has replied
  
jar
Member (Idle past 423 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004

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Message 73 of 159 (185130)
02-14-2005 12:50 PM 		Reply to: Message 69 by Jordo86
02-14-2005 12:35 PM

Re: Workmen
In this analogy, the workmen. But i told you i think this analogy is flawed.
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Okay, I know you think it's flawed but humor an old man.
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Where do you think the workmen got their energy?
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And we can certainly continue this tomorrow (or today if on my end) LOL
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Aslan is not a Tame Lion
This message is a reply to:
 Message 69 by Jordo86, posted 02-14-2005 12:35 PM Jordo86 has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 75 by Jordo86, posted 02-14-2005 12:59 PM jar has not replied
  
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