Does Creationisim preclude faith?

quote:

---

If it was ever proven to you, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that Creationisim is bunk. Would that be a serious blow to your religion?

---

Hello Yaro,Creationism and religion, specifically Christianity, though not synonomous, are very closely related. From a Christian viewpoint, I will say, "Yes, of course, my religion would be threatened, if not completely demolished." However, I can not imagine circumstances in which this becomes a possibility. I would "assume" most proponents of other religions, such as Darwinism and Goldschmidtism, would be equally devestated.

quote:

---

Ahh, the old "Darwinism = religion" idea. It's a serious cheap shot

---

Yes it was; my poor attempt at humor.

quote:

---

(not to mention being totally cliche in YEC circles)

---

Possibly true, I wouldn't know.

quote:

---

and I don't think it's justified.

---

No offense intended, my friend. I knew it would ruffle some feathers. My apologies.Cheers

quote:

---

How very odd! Since the majority of Christians don't have any such problem. In addition a goodly percentage of mainstream scientitists are religious.

---

Hello Ned,
I never asserted that Christianity/religion precludes science. I am only stating that a Creator is necessary for Christianity, in it's historical, Biblical sense, to exist. I certainly don't think that science and Christianity are mutually exclusive.

quote:

---

It is hard for me to see the connection.

---

Of course, Ned, you understand that Creationism, in its broadest sense, is a basic tenent of Christianity.Cheers

quote:

---

This second and, here, NEW use of the word "creationism" is, of course, a tenant of Christianity. But Creationism, as it has been used all along here is clearly NOT a tenant of Christianity.

---

Fair enough.

quote:

---

I think that you're taking a view of Creationism too broad to have meaning.

---

Perhaps.

quote:

---

Creationism, as creationists usually define it, isn't just the idea that there's a Creator god, because that idea isn't contradictory to evolution.

---

This depends on whether we are discussing progressive creationism or theistic evolution. The latter of which can not be easily reconciled with the biblical account of creation.

quote:

---

Creationism is the specific belief that God created (at least) life on Earth via a process different than the accepted evolutionary view.

---

So do you consider all opponents to "accepted evolutionary view" creationists? I want to make sure we are all on the same page. Please clarify your position on this.

quote:

---

What you were talking about - creationism in the "broadest sense" - is what most people call "evolutionary theism."

---

I would agree that most may call it "evolutionary theism." However, I think that "progressive creationism" more aptly dscribes the position I am taking.Cheers

quote:

---

You could clarify your position yourself.

---

Certainly, this is a fair question. I consider myself to be a proponent of Progressive(process)Creation. Beyond that, I'll refrain. I wish to be taken seriously by those on both sides of the evolution/creation controversy.

quote:

---

What is progressive creationism, if that is the term you used?

---

There are three(probably more)popular models under the umbrella of progressive creationism.1)The Gap Theory
Proponents of the Gap theory hold a literal biblical interpretation of Genesis' creation account, with one exception; the proposition that a gap exists between Genesis 1:1 "God created the heavens and the earth...", and verse 1:2, "and the earth WAS without form and void. Because God could not create imperfectly, the word "became" is substituted for "was" (the more accurate translation.) This theory allows an indefinite time period for geologic evidence to amass, therefore reconciliation with scientific evidence.2)Day-Age theory
"Days" in the biblical account of creation are chronological, but overlapping, unspecified periods of time. These are not literal 24hr days as YEC advocates purport(specifically, but not exclusively the first three days before the sun and moon were visible.). Moreover, the evidence in the fossil record, and the big bang theory are affirmed. However, man was created as a "special" being, and is NOT in the lineage of other hominids.3)Framework theory
This theory states that the creation account in Genesis is a metaphorical week, used for the narrative purposes. The six workday week used is analogous to Israel's week. The "days" may not be chronological but topical representions of various creative acts.Theistic evolution, on the other hand, posits a creator who initiated the "big bang," then relinquished control to evolution. This creator would periodically intervene when necessary. Hence, the term "God of the gaps" was coined by opponents of the theory.The ideas within these particular models will certainly vary between communities. These general representations are not intended to encompass all aspects of the theories. This is simply my understanding of some of the basic foundational premises.

quote:

---

It seems there are more different creationist postitions than there are creationists

---

Even more, when popular ID theories are considered.