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Author | Topic: Who can explain following: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 440 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Dongsheng Zhang writes: In fact, when a whirlwind or tornado occurs in the northern hemisphere, its helical-direction is always counterclockwise just like the right-handed helix. I can appreciate your unfamiliarity with the English language, but the passage in Ezekiel clearly states that the whirlwind "came out" of the north, not that it was "in" the northern hemisphere. The reference to "north" has nothing to do with "handedness". It refers to the direction the whirlwind was moving macroscopically, not to it's internal motion. You should also be aware that the handedness of a helix (or anything else) is just a convention - i.e. your right thumb points "north" when your fingers follow the lines of force, etc. How could Ezekiel possibly have known about our modern (arbitrary) convention of handedness? And why would he speak in terms that wouldn't be understood until thousands of years later? Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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anastasia Member (Idle past 5981 days) Posts: 1857 From: Bucks County, PA Joined: |
Astonishing that this debate has been going for 1600+ years!
Augustine of Hippo writes: “It not infrequently happens that something about the earth, about the sky, about other elements of this world, about the motion and rotation or even the magnitude and distances of the stars, about definite eclipses of the sun and moon, about the passage of years and seasons, about the nature of animals, of fruits, of stones, and of other such things, may be known with the greatest certainty by reasoning or by experience, even by one who is not a Christian. It is too disgraceful and ruinous, though, and greatly to be avoided, that he [the non-Christian] should hear a Christian speaking so idiotically on these matters, and as if in accord with Christian writings, that he might say that he could scarcely keep from laughing when he saw how totally in error they are. In view of this and in keeping it in mind constantly while dealing with the book of Genesis, I have, insofar as I was able, explained in detail and set forth for consideration the meanings of obscure passages, taking care not to affirm rashly some one meaning to the prejudice of another and perhaps better explanation." (The Literal Interpretation of Genesis 1:19-20, Chapt. 19 [AD 408]) With the scriptures it is a matter of treating about the faith. For that reason, as I have noted repeatedly, if anyone, not understanding the mode of divine eloquence, should find something about these matters [about the physical universe] in our books, or hear of the same from those books, of such a kind that it seems to be at variance with the perceptions of his own rational faculties, let him believe that these other things are in no way necessary to the admonitions or accounts or predictions of the scriptures. In short, it must be said that our authors knew the truth about the nature of the skies, but it was not the intention of the Spirit of God, who spoke through them, to teach men anything that would not be of use to them for their salvation." (ibid, 2:9)” It is more astonishing that the fathers of the Reformation relied so heavily on Augustine's teachings, and yet at some point their spiritual descendants abandoned them. God does not intend to reveal to us the workings of science, nor to make salvation available only to the scientifically learned. If there is a devil, I am sure he finds it hilarious that this type of studying of the bible has caused so many to lose their faith in God altogether. I don't believe God has encoded knowledge of DNA, any more than He has encoded Shakespeare. It is not His intention to explain science. If there are at times astonishing coincidences between the manifestations of God in the Bible, and natural phenomena, then perhaps we can still say that science at times can explain God, and that it is not surprising to find parallels or similarities between His creations.
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Chiroptera Inactive Member |
Well, there are also people who think Isaiah 40:22 describes a spherical earth in a cosmologically expanding universe.
On the other hand, I admit that at least that is a little more reasonable than this "Ezekiel was attacked by a giant strand of DNA" thing going on here. Never believe anything in politics until it has been officially denied. -- Otto von Bismarck
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anastasia Member (Idle past 5981 days) Posts: 1857 From: Bucks County, PA Joined: |
Then maybe Isaiah 40:12 = Big Bang?
'who has comprehended the earth in a measure?' kidding...
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Hyroglyphx Inactive Member |
Then maybe Isaiah 40:12 = Big Bang? He's referring to the passage that says, "He sits enthroned above the circle of the earth." -Isaiah 40:22 There's also another one that seems to speak about gravity ling before anyone knew of such a concept. Its in Job somewhere, but I can't seem to find the passage. It says, (not sure if its verbatim) "He stretches out the northern sky and suspends the earth over nothing." -Job something:something "With derision the atheist points out that there can be no God because this world is so unfair. Without hesitation, I concur with him. Indeed, we live in an unfair world because of all sorts of social ills and perils. I must not contend with such a sentiment because it is factual-- we don't live in a fair world. Grace is unambiguous proof that we live in an unfair world. I received salvation when I deserved condemnation. Yes, indeed this world is unfair." -Andrew Jaramillo-
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 313 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
There's also another one that seems to speak about gravity ling before anyone knew of such a concept. ... i.e. before Ug the caveman proposed his famous theory: "Ug drop rock, rock fall down." You will recall that his chief critic, Ik, a Neanderthal, replied: "Gravity, him just theory." Ug showed him the thing with the rock again. "That just microfalling," said Ik. "Show me with rock so heavy no-one can lift it, then I believe you."
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Hyroglyphx Inactive Member |
Ug showed him the thing with the rock again. "That just microfalling," said Ik. "Show me with rock so heavy no-one can lift it, then I believe you. Cute.... Would Ug have understood that that the earth is round and that its suspended? Everybody knew that what goes up must come down long before Newton. What they didn't understand is why. "With derision the atheist points out that there can be no God because this world is so unfair. Without hesitation, I concur with him. Indeed, we live in an unfair world because of all sorts of social ills and perils. I must not contend with such a sentiment because it is factual-- we don't live in a fair world. Grace is unambiguous proof that we live in an unfair world. I received salvation when I deserved condemnation. Yes, indeed this world is unfair." -Andrew Jaramillo-
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Cthulhu Member (Idle past 5880 days) Posts: 273 From: Roe Dyelin Joined: |
Ug lived near the ocean, so he did know that the world was a sphere.
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AdminBuzsaw Inactive Member |
Hi Ringo. Nice to have you back among us. I see 2C as closely enough related to topic so as to be considered on topic for the purpose of this thread to discuss the Ezekiel phenomenon, especially since it may have some bearing on the points of the OP. Perhaps if another moderator sees it differently they could weigh in here.
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Buzsaw Inactive Member |
Job 26:7 your reference for the stretching out of the North.
Edited by Buzsaw, : change title BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW ---- Jesus said, "When these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads, for your redemption draws near." Luke 21:28
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jar Member (Idle past 422 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Likely since Ug was as ignorant of reality as the Bible authors. Now though we know that the earth is not round nor is it suspended.
The various authors of the Bible certainly tried to explain the world they knew, included "Just So Stories", but they always got it wrong. The authors of the Bible should not be faulted for getting it wrong. Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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ringo Member (Idle past 440 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
AdminBuzsaw writes: I see 2C as closely enough related to topic so as to be considered on topic for the purpose of this thread.... I have no problem with 2C being on-topic for this thread. I'm wary of the stated topic of the thread being avoided by branching out into related areas. When one of the key premises is refuted, the originator should address that point, not sally forth into other areas. Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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AdminBuzsaw Inactive Member |
Thanks Ringo. We'll try to see to it that it doesn't stray beyond a reasonable perameter.
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jar Member (Idle past 422 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
When one of the key premises is refuted, the originator should address that point, not sally forth into other areas. Are you actually saying that you think Biblical Nonsense should be defended instead of simply making yet another truly silly assertion? Prediction: Dong will NEVER support any of his nonsense but just continue posting the same stuff he would not defend in Message 1. Just a guess but expect 13 more ridiculous and unsupported posts from Dong on this thread and then he will be off to some other flight of fantasy. Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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Hyroglyphx Inactive Member |
That would be the one.. Thank you Mr. Buz
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