Did Jesus die in vain?

[qs]As you are a self proclaimed atheist I wonder why you joined this topic?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------Because this is in "free for all" not faith and belief and because I didn't see a disclaimer that said "christians only". You asked a question, I provided an answer.[qs] OK As a self proclaimed atheist I wonger why you were interested in the topic? A genuine question.

Well, even his teachings aren't followed, and heaven and hell are not of this world so does Jesus only help the born again in this world?

"Our" is the "whole" of humanity affecting "all" our lives today. Was not this Jesus purpose?

Why does Jesus divide humanity in this way? How does he make it possible to be saved?

I think it was a fair assumption to make as christians do believe this to be true. I used to sing hymms about jesus dying for us and I did believe it.My personal opinion concerning the life of jesus has radically changed from that I had ingrained in me as a child. It seems you too have a different perception of the teachings of jesus.
I no longer believe jesus died for our sins at all. I now find it quite ludicrous to know I did believe it, without question. What about you?

Ah, I've done it again. Apologies. I meant the 'concept' of christian theolgy as believed by many. To those who believe it, it is true. For those who don't, it is a concept. Maybe the entire reason for jesus' existence is a concept. Maybe the existence of sin is a concept. Maybe the existence of god is a concept. They are not provable or disprovable until obseved in reality.The accuracy of the bible is not in question in this thread. The debate is concerned with the concepts and interpretations of the bible, which are deadly serious. The assumptions of the meanings are those which I wish to dispute. Well, you are entitled to keep your own council. However, I feel if I personally am not prepared to stand up for my beliefs then I have no right to dispute anothers'. I've been called far worse than an x, mostly on this forum, but I know it is the name caller who has these thoughts, not I. Regards

I am disgusted with your reply.

Jeez, what a load of b#######!
Good god, what a small world in that mind-set.
Don't you give any credit to the rest of humanity?

Hallelujah to that!I am sick of being told to respect others beliefs systems when they clearly oppose mine. Religous belief systems drive me nuts! Crazy! Crazy! Giving control of their own lives up to a fictious god. Unbelievable! What are they so afraid of?

I have observed believers seemingly living thier lives in order to go to heaven when they die. Fear of eternal damnation is a pretty good reason to believe but it doesn't allow much freedom to live.Religious beliefs do not accept/incorporate humanity as normal. The foundation belief is that we are not perfect which in itself leads us not be ourselves. Some lives are completely lived trying to be better.The self-rightious amongst the believers even think they are better. What happened to we are all equal?My observations are purely from my own life experiences and maybe some religions lead the way to become everything you can be. Maybe they teach their young to draw their own conclusions and make their own decisions. Maybe there are some who teach to believe in yourself and nothing else matters, but I haven't found one yet.

I see your view is mainly through 'laws'. My perspective is from the human being's experience of all these 'laws'. How religious beliefs {laws) affect the individual human being and humanity as a whole.

This obviously doesn't apply to Goerge Bush Or, 'are we believing a fairytale and do not want to grow up and take responsibility for the screw up'?

Everything is a law insofar as they exist including fear, hate etc; but surely it is down to choice?

Choosing to love or fear does not require a law. It's a normal response. How do you know which laws are true and correct?

I think you are contradicting yourself here and losing me in the process