Importance of Original Sin

Now, what is the living word of god other than more carny con-games and word salad?

Phat writes:The word itself is not mere human interpretation...it is God Breathed.

Phat writes:...this is not some basic common sense that any buffoon who wishes to understand it and also keep their own imagination and outlook can even see.

Nope. you get no more.

jar writes:And just how do you determine that other than using logic, reason and reality? You could use emotion; is that what you use? When something makes you feel good you accept it and when something makes you feel bad you reject it?

jar writes:I am a Christian, a devout Christian and an honest Christian.

jar writes:Now, what is the living word of god other than more carny con-games and word salad?

jar writes:Ah, how is that different than checking your brain at the door?

jar writes:How do you test to see if the interpretation you get is not mere human interpretation? Is there a label that says "Hecho en Paraiso"?

I am a Christian, a devout Christian and an honest Christian.

On the other hand, you believe the wisdom of humans who are of natural mind and have no idea of what "The Spirit" even is.

I fear that since you never did (and likely never will) surrender your brain to God, you will always sit on a stump...just outside of communion with Him...and ask a billion questions.

The Bible is not to be understood by reading since by filtering the words of the Bible through linguistic filters keeps human wisdom atop it all.

The Bible is not to be understood by reading since by filtering the words of the Bible through linguistic filters keeps human wisdom atop it all.

jar writes: I am a Christian, a devout Christian and an honest Christian.

jaywill writes:Ask him if he is then a part of his oft ridiculed "Christian club" or "club Christian."Then sit back and watch him dance.

jar writes:until you tell me how to recognize and test "superior wisdom" there is not much point in going on is there?

jar writes:Now, what is the living word of god other than more carny con-games and word salad?

John 1:1-2 writes:In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning.

Theodoric writes:Any attempt Phat ever made to make a coherent reasoned comment about religion or the bible is destroyed utterly by this one comment. This is beyond word salad, it is beyond delusion. But it tells us a lot about the thinking of a certain segment of religious people.

Rom 11:8 writes:-- as it is written:
"God gave them a spirit of stupor,
eyes so that they could not see
and ears so that they could not hear,
to this very day."

jar writes:And you cannot tell us what "The Spirit" is and how to tell the difference between the spirit and a bad burrito

Vine's Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words writes:SPIRIT (OF THE DEAD), NECROMANCER--'ob OT:178,"spirit (of the dead); necromancer; pit." This word has cognates in Sumerian, Akkadian, and Ugaritic, where the meanings "pit" and "spirit of one who has died" occur. In its earliest appearances (Sumerian), 'ob refers to a pit out of which a departed spirit may be summoned. Later Assyrian texts use this word to denote simply a pit in the ground. Akkadian texts describe a deity that is the personification of the pit, to whom a particular exorcism ritual was addressed. Biblical Hebrew attests this word 16 times.The word usually represents the troubled spirit (or spirits) of the dead. This meaning appears unquestionably in Isa 29:4: "...thy voice shall be, as of one that hath a familiar spirit, out of the ground, and thy speech shall whisper out of the dust."Its second meaning, "necromancer," refers to a professional who claims to summon forth such spirits when requested (or hired) to do so: "Regard not them that have familiar spirits, neither seek after wizards" Lev 19:31-- first occurrence. These mediums summoned their "guides" from a hole in the ground. Saul asked the medium (witch) of Endor, "Divine for me from the hole ['ob] 1 Sam 28:8, author's translation.God forbade Israel to seek information by this means, which was so common among the pagans Lev 19:31; Deut 18:11. Perhaps the pagan belief in manipulating one's basic relationship to a god (or gods) explains the relative silence of the Old Testament regarding life after death. Yet God's people believed in life after death, from early times (e. g., Gen 37:35; Isa 14:15 ff.).Necromancy was so contrary to God's commands that its practitioners were under the death penalty Deut 13. Necromancers' unusual experiences do not prove that they truly had power to summon the dead. For example, the medium of Endor could not snatch Samuel out of God's hands against His wishes. But in this particular incident, it seems that God rebuked Saul's apostasy, either through a revived Samuel or through a vision of Samuel. Mediums do not have power to summon the spirits of the dead, since this is reprehensible to God and contrary to His will.

ruach OT:7307 writes: SPIRIT; BREATH, "breath; air; strength; wind; breeze; spirit; courage; temper; Spirit." This noun has cognates in Ugaritic, Aramaic, and Arabic. The word occurs about 378 times and in all periods of biblical Hebrew.First, this word means "breath," air for breathing, air that is being breathed. This meaning is especially evident in Jer 14:6: "And the wild asses did stand in the high places, they snuffed up the wind like dragons...." When one's "breath" returns, he is revived: "...when he [Samson] had drunk [the water], his spirit [literally, "breath"] came again, and he revived..." Judg 15:19. Astonishment may take away one's "breath": "And when the queen of Sheba had seen all Solomon's wisdom, and the home that he had built, And the meat of his table,... there was no more spirit in her [she was overwhelmed and breathless]" 1 Kings 10:4-5. Ruach may also represent speaking, or the breath of one's mouth: "By the word of the Lord were the heavens made; and all the host of them by the breath of his mouth" Ps. 33:6>; cf. Ex 15:8; Job 4:9; 19:17.Second, this word can be used with emphasis on the invisible, intangible, fleeting quality of "air": "O remember that my life is wind: mine eyes shall no more see good" Job 7:7. There may be a suggestion of purposelessness, uselessness, or even vanity (emptiness) when ruach is used with this significance: "And the prophets shall become wind, and the word is not in them..." Jer 5:13. "Windy words" are really "empty words" Job 16:3, just as "windy knowledge" is "empty knowledge" Job 15:2 cf. Eccl 1:14,17--" meaningless striving". In Prov 11:29 ruach means "nothing": "He that troubleth his own house shall inherit the wind...." This nuance is especially prominent in Eccl 5:15-16: "And he came forth of his mother's womb, naked shall he return to go as he came, and shall take nothing of his labor, which he may carry away in his hand. And this also is a sore evil, that in all points as he came, so shall he go: and what profit hath he that hath labored for the wind?"Third, ruach can mean "wind." In Gen 3:8 it seems to mean the gentle, refreshing evening breeze so well known in the Near East: "And they heard the voice of the Lord God walking in the garden in the cool [literally, "breeze"] of the day...." It can mean a strong, constant wind: "...and the Lord brought an east wind upon the land all that day, and all that night..." Ex 10:13. It can also signify an extremely strong wind: "And the Lord turned a mighty strong west wind..." Ex 10:19. In Jer 4:11 the word appears to represent a gale or tornado (cf. Hos 8:7). God is the Creator Amos 4:13 and sovereign Controller of the winds Gen 8:1; Num 11:31; Jer 10:13.Fourth, the wind represents direction. In Jer 49:36 the four winds represent the four ends of the earth, which in turn represent every quarter: "And upon Elam will I bring the four winds [peoples from every quarter of the earth] from the four quarters of heaven, and will scatter them toward all those winds; and there shall be no nation whither the outcasts of Elam shall not come." Akkadian attests the same phrase with the same meaning, and this phrase begins to appear in Hebrew at a time when contact with Akkadian-speaking peoples was frequent.Fifth, ruach frequently represents the element of life in a man, his natural "spirit": "And all flesh died that moved upon the earth,... All in whose nostrils was the breath of life..." Gen 7:21-22. In these verses the animals have a "spirit" (cf. Ps 104:29). On the other hand, in Prov 16:2 the word appears to mean more than just the element of life; it seems to mean "soul": "All the ways of a man are clean in his own eyes; but the Lord weigheth the spirits [NASB, "motives"]." Thus, Isaiah can put nepesh, "soul," and ruach in synonymous parallelism: "With my soul have I desired thee in the night; yea, with my spirit within me will I seek thee early..." 26:9. It is the "spirit" of a man that returns to God Eccl 12:7

Ringo writes:You have to interpret God's breath the same way everybody else does, by logic, reason and possibly even reality.

Ahhh yes, the peanut gallery. Welcome, Theodoric..welcome. Of course it appears that you already have your mind made up about the Bible...thus you won't learn anything.

We believe that the word was the word before it was even written down by humans.

Phat writes:What I meant was that the Bible is not understood through human wisdom alone.