The Foundations of the Debate

Evolution only has a toe hold in science, while (deceived?) Christians keep trying to make The Bible a middle eastern book written by middle eastern people.
It's impossible to make full sence of all it has to teach us, while we insist on restricting it's full scope.It starts and ends with the whole world and all peoples.Mizraim is NOT modern Egypt, the Euphrates is NOT the modern Euphrates, the radiant image of God we were created in, DIED, so God covered us in skin, to keep our rotting selves in, the continants didn't divide untill after the Flood, and assuming the earthquake Amos mentions, was only local, is way too arrogant to bed down with science.Modern 'Israel' is NOT the Biblical Promised Land, but though The Bible describes it clearly, acceptance of the 'evolution' and the 'craddle of civilisation' Lies, keep blinding people to key passages they read as 'unimportant'.Funny thing is, all the Christians I know, dumped the crock that evolution is, well before they found Christian Faith. Wouldn't that explain why evolutionists are sooo desperate to shove their flimsy "faith" down everyones throat?Evolution THEORY was designed for the purpose of blinding people to the truth of Our Creator, through stroking their carnal pride and lusts.

It's a cute reply, and made me chuckle, but added to my point; every boy and girl since the Scopes trial, HAS grown up with Evolution THEORY, "Drip Fed" as FACT, into EVERY aspect of life, particularly, " "They" just 'invented' a god to control everything you do, and stop you having 'fun'!"People do 'lust' after "doing great things for humanity" and their 'pride' does stop them admitting they were mistaken, fooled or deceived.Just once, I'd like to see Evolutionists admit that the THEORY they have so much "faith" in, has been sold to the world as FACT, BEFORE PROOF, which in every other walk of life, is a sign of being swindled.I know I've been swindled out of every archeological "anomoly" DIS-proving evolution, hitting the international mainstream media on first speculation, as FACT, like 'hobbit' and 'mars life on rock' ANTI-science does for the Anti-Creator crowd.

It's an impossible dabate to have if you choose to believe the likes of Darwin and his ilk, don't have an Anti-Biblical agenda.Saddly, even when you connect the dots of 'religious conspiracy' that feed evolution THEORY, evolutionist scream, "What about the science!", so then you have to connect all 'conspiracies in science' dots, where the Anti-Biblical folk will bog you down in the 'dating' debate forever.This really shouldn't be an issue for Bible believing Christians (as opposed to Trinitarian Trained 'Christians'), as Genesis starts with the RE-Creation of the world, AFTER the great war between God and Satan, that nearly destroyed everything. The first creation isn't mentioned 'till John.But I do have a theory as to why we are lied to, about what The Bible actually says, and why evolution is sold so agressively, BEFORE BECOMING FACT; proper study of The Bible, clearly shows modern Israel isn't situated in the Promised Land.People WILL worship the Beast, because the whole world is looking in the wrong place for the wrong signs, which God's enemies are constructing to 'fit' their deliberate MISS-telling of science and The Bible.Only one place fits all the discriptive meanings of Israel's Promised land, but you can't find it if you read The Bible as a Middle Eastern book written by and for Middle Eastern people, WHICH IT CLEARLY IS NOT.THEORIES ('stumbling blocks') of evolution, history, geology and other sciences, have long stopped the world reading The Bible as it is written; FOR and ABOUT the WHOLE world, and ALL peoples.This is NO ACCIDENT!I did once believe evolution didn't cancell out God, untill I discovered my faith had always been Christian and not the Catholic counterfeit my family tried to raise me in.
I couldn't square Catholic doctrine with science, which I love, then discovered Catholic wasn't Christian...I was right to 'instinctively' refuse to 'pray to Mary' as a child, but go straight to Christ...what else had I been 'taught' as 'Christian' but couldn't accept, that wasn't actually in The Bible?
Just about everything that lets 'men of science'(lets not forget the Jesuit influence on 'learning'), get in and stab at God and Biblical Truth!

You folk really should remember that the whole world isn't under the sway of the American marketing of their "Prosperity NOW", counterfeit 'Christianity'.Australia isn't America; we get no end of, "Only idiots believe in God!", peppered heavily throughout our social lives, media and entertainment.There is no social benefit to admitting you belief in The Bible, here, unless you're busy NETworking with some other counterfeit 'Christian' 'church'.People are caused to question, search and study through their own spirit, 'seeing' and 'hearing' anomolies that men of science can't or won't answer.To become a record setting and holding, breeder of Champions, around the world, I had to understand biology, genetics, 'seasons', and even the history of mans movements and migrations, among many other facts of life, nature and science...and tripped over glaring anomolies all over the place.It was by pursuing my worldly love of animals and nature, that I kept coming back to The Bible (a book that speaks well to a farmers mind), and finally had to admit it had better answers than all the 'boffins' I had to deal with, and that I'd always been Christian (NOT Trinitarian)in my understanding of life and the world.Raised Catholic, I had plenty of good reasons to resist 'religion', and to this day I don't belong to a worldly "church", as they all still hold onto a stumbling block (as mentioned in the letters to the 7 'churches'), bar the little powerless one, of spirit called, believers in our Redeeming Creator.

Couldn't be calmer.What you call an "unfocused rant", was a very focused, 'shorthand' statement of why those with faith in evolution THEORY, don't 'play fair' and keep 'moving the goal posts'.As creation covers, all creation, it has to be a huge topic;if you couldn't follow those simple hops, from little lies told about The Bible, leading to most people being deceived into worshiping the Beast, I don't know how you could possibly make sence of ALL the scientific papers that you need to make a case for evolution.Or do you just 'have faith', the "Industry of Science" would never lie to, deceieve or mis-lead ANYONE...like fellow scientists they destroy to advance their own careers.Though I do read your post as "panicky", due to your need to repeat the word, "rant"; a favourite tactic to shut others ears to the speaker.Or is it that you don't like folk mentioning that evolution, along with geology, archeology and history, are deliberately mis-taught to keep the world looking in the wrong place for the wrong signs?It also astounds me that Evolutionists get away with stating their case is proven, "As well as it needs to be?!?!", untill The Faithfull can "prove God".Well at least these forums prove one warning sign of end times; the wide spread of much knowledge, but no understanding.

You're funny.Do folk still use the, "The Bible says the world is flat" lie, to call Christians idiots?Christians never believed that rot, it was just another Trinitarian lie.Anyway, great to finally meet someone who 'knows' evolution is a 'fact' and doesn't just believe all the anomolies in the 'facts' of nature, won't some day be adjusted and made to fit the Theory.

Please, learn to separate world opinion from American.Long before 1920, Darwinism had well and truely taken off and was being 'drip fed' through all sorts of social cliques, and very much so through the arts.Adults had to be 'converted' around the world, through social interaction, before America would dare let it into schools.But we all know kids are absorbed by and remember movies, line for line (unlike most school lessons), and evolution had a wonderfull way of making it into the dialog of movies on all subject matters, while ridiculous Catholic doctrine kept popping up as Christian, since the very begining of that brainwashing industry.So if the media isn't so powerfull in forming peoples opinions, why don't we get as many 'teen coming of age' movies that explain the science behind sexual morality, like the bonding hormone released by women during intercourse that explains why men keep being stalked by women who really thought they only wanted casual sex?But again, you confuse (deliberately?) Bible belief with religious doctrine falsely claiming to be Christian; they are VERY different.See, you sort of give yourself away here...from evolution to the, "It's all about sex" arguement.Also, why is it so very important, to have the world accept a theory that has no practical application (we've 'evolved' nothing better than what is), other than causing people to deny our Creator?

The topic is, The Foundation of the Debate.Evolutionists keep going on about science, but my 'attitude' is questioned because I address the TOPIC?Don't scientist argue enough among themselves?There's plenty of debate over the validity of countless statements science promotes as 'close enough' to being proven, but I chose to join this discussion because of the title of the topic, then get told off for addressing it?!The Foundation of the Debate, lies in Religious Conspiracy, and has been around since Nimrod.Now lets see, I don't believe Catholic doctrine (that has infected nearly every 'Christian' church and so nearly everyones idea of what Christianity is), so you post a link to another of Rome's many bastard children, the flat earth society?Thanks for making a little of my point; people of power and influence have always lied about what The Bible actually says, and God cops the blame for the wretched results.It's interesting to, that where ever you go to debate religious issues, Christians are brutally attacked for every crime and idocy of Catholic doctrine and education, untill they point out those beliefs are NOT Christian, then they get attacked for another 'sin' against Catholic doctrine, of 'judging' Rome.You see, you can't attack Christianity, if you don't "forgive" Catholic/Jesuit's, because they spawned and control the faulty 'science and education', used to attack the truth of creation.Now many people stumble at the thought man was created in Gods image, as common sence tells us our bodies aren't 'God Like'.
But that original creation DIED when Death came into the world, and God covered us in skin, to keep our rotting selves in, so anti-Christs have seeded our minds with images of fig leafs and ugg boots, and keep ignoring this very important Biblical detail of our current carnality?Which brings us back to The Foundation of the Debate; The Lie that man can/will evolve into a 'higher being', and so keep ignoring His offer to be Truely, born again, into those original radiant beings, at His return.
The Father of the Lie, wants us all dead, and never re-born into the healed world.Edited by suzy, : explaination of 'attitude'.

See, another cheap shot at stearing the conversation away from the topic.
I name you one anomoly, you argue that 'science', and further avoid the question of WHY evolutionists MUST replace creation with their "faith", in the hearts of all peoples.Or maybe you genuinely believe there are no glaring anomolies in any field of the sciences.
If that's the case, google, "archeological anomolies" or "out of place artifacts", and start to get familier with "the science wars".Again, everyone is taught the, "two by two" 'story', but the important detail of 'clean animals' collected in 7 pairs, is ignored because it explains the genetic variety in domestic animals, that selective breeding can't.And then we could cover the whole mess of when a horse is a horse or load bearing animal/means of transport etc., that keep people excluding most of the world from Biblical scripture, and so not making sence of it.See, the Foundation of the Debate, or rather, The Beginning of the Conspiracy, is as ancient as man, has permiated all aspects of life, and depends greatly on repeat, repeat, repeating lies, about what The Bible actually says.And no, I don't believe in a young earth, just a young humanity (that once lived to great ages, despite constant hard work and heavy load bearing, that explains those heavy boned ancient skeletons), as The Bible describes.My belief in The Creator and The Good News He left us, won't stop any evolutionist evolving anything (if it were possible), but it anoys the hell out of those who can't explain the existance of the domestic dog, domestic grain, why native South Americans are a genetic cross between African AND Australian aboriginals and Sth. America and New Zealand sharing unique flora and fauna, just for starters.But even more so, it anoys those who believe modern Israel is situated in The Promised Land of The Bible, because they hinge so much of their faith on 'historic proof', rather than the whole of The Bible and the world it describes and tells us to study, which reveals answers to questions, many haven't even thought to ask.The Super-Continant (that science supports and The Bible tells of) didn't divide untill way after Noah, and then it didn't happen in one hit, but still folk try to put the Euphrates of the Super-Continant, down as that trickle in the Middle East, and Mizraim in modern Egypt.
Why, if it isn't a deliberate miss-direction?And sorry, but I'm not one for answering quote for quote, as it has the intended habit of curtailing the introduction of ideas capable of dodging evolutionists 'tired old war horses'.I'm just 'dropping the words'.
If others don't care to hear, ponder and search it out for themselves, no amount of posting links to creation science, 'the science wars' and geological and historic anomolies will inspire them to do so, and usually just turns into a debate about author or site credibility, and the key issues get re-buried.I'm too aware of the purpose of most Creation/Evolution forums, being to badger, insult, belittle and mock folk away from even thinking about what The Bible actually says, to play the forum game, by anti-Christ's "goal post shifting rules", so I hope the enlightened evolutionists and Trinitarians can "tolerate" and "forgive" my particular communication style, which is to ignor red herrings, strawmen and 'poisoned bait', but ask others to search out answers to un-asked question.
Surely, that isn't the 'wrong attitude' to this particular topic.

Genesis 3;21, in the Hebrew simply says God covered then in hides, later 'interpretations''assumed' this ment He 'clothed' them in cave man garb.They could see they were 'naked'(from the root implying 'smoothness': flat, no longer radiating?) because being 'dead', they no longer had their protective radiance of when they were "in the image of God".Again, this brings us back to the foundation of the debate, lying in the ignorance of these many overlooked, scattered but connected 'one liners' that wash non-sence doctrines out of The Bible.It also shows us that we still suffer the desire to "become gods", in that so many 'Christians' want to belive God's image is the same as our dead, rotting, fleshly bodies. Edited by AdminPD, : Off Topic Warning

Woah there, when did I say I was anything other than a Bible Believing Christian?If you want to hunt down some cult that holds with some of what I understand, in order to discredit any of the scripture I'm raising, I can't stop you, but it will show you're 'playing us and them', with what you decide worthy of consideration.I don't restrict myself to "approved" or "accepted" teachings or doctrines, when I search for understanding, but look for common threads and patterns of known truth and known lies, in deciding what to accept, reject and keep searching.And why do you have such a big problem with my mentioning a point of time BEFORE the Scopes trial?
That old black and white movie, along with popular songs like, "It ain't necessarly so", were causing great upset in our early 60's Catholic, large, extended, immigrant family and neighbourhood, all the way over here in Australia, just as Darwinism did, around the world, long before.That's why I raised it, to show popular media does much more damage to general understanding of Biblical Scripture, world wide, that America deciding to teach evolution in schools.It was another poster who 'assumed' I ment it brought evolution into schools, or claimed it, in order to call me a lier or fool.But this is the danger of debating religion in NET forums; leave out one well known detail, and you're accused of ignorance, include one too many and you're accused of 'ranting'.That you can claim popular media's obsession with selling the idea that, random multiple sex partners are fine and dandy, "has no bearing on the matter", shows a bias, ignorant or lying foundation to your promotion of evolution, particularly when combined with the rest of your elephant sized miss-interpretations of what I'm writing, and those 'fringe groups' you so need me to belong to, despite my making it clear that they too harm the greater understanding of what The Bible actually teaches. Edited by AdminPD, : Off Topic Warning

Now see, I'd feel better if those repeating the old, "why you can't believe The Bible", lies, got a personal warning (particularly as they aren't newbies to this forums rules), about straying off topic too.And it seems odd, that when the topic is "The Foundation", which must go back to creation, which we agree can't be proven, that I'm asked for 'evidence', but my reasons, for my arguements seem to need some 'fringe group' to back them up.How do you exchange new ideas, if they're ignored (as many of my key points TO THE TOPIC)for not spawning from some "accepted body", who's weak points are well known and have a range of pre-prepared 'mental missiles' to shoot at them?So I'll go straight to my understanding of "Why this (and nearly every other 'Creation/Evolution) forum exists"; as I said, and was ignored, before, to humiliate 'seekers' into total rejection of The Bible. Edited by AdminPD, : Warning

See, again there's the assuption that the faith came before rejecting evolution, and that creationists are looking to preacher to tell them what to believe, but how can genuine students of the subject make such an 'assuption' if the intent isn't to just 'influence' new seekers who hit this site.And why keep asking to provide 'proofs'you can google in an instant to find detailed papers on, if you don't hope 'lazy seekers' won't take your lead and look no further?See, I see this on forums all the time, and students of 'social engineering' know, this aspect of the NET is a priceless tool for the Cororate 'dictatorship' running the world.Thats where all the real money and power of sell evolution is.