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Author | Topic: The Awesome Republican Primary Thread | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Rahvin Member Posts: 4046 Joined: Member Rating: 8.3 |
While there are some tea party members who are racist, and others who are not... if you look at the makeup of the party, the percentage of members of the Tea Party who are very vocal racists is much higher than the general population. I actually have no data on the distribution of racism in either the general population or the Tea Party. Do you actually have that data? Without it, it's impossible to draw the conclusion you've just drawn. Perception is not the same as reality, and our perception of both the prevalence of racism in the general populace and racism in the Tea Party are unlikely to be accurate, simply because of the bias inherent in what is "news" and thus likely to garner media attention. Jim Bob down the street is unlikely to appear on national news outlets even if he's the Grand Wizard of the KKK; Johnny Racist in the Tea Party is more likely to get on TV because he'll show up at the White House for a large rally with a racist sign and a Confederate flag. He doesn't necessarily represent the Tea Party as a whole, but he'll get TV time because he's likely to get an emotional reaction from the viewers and thus push up ratings...and this, without even requiring any sort of intentional deception from anyone, can color our collective perception and introduce bias in the conclusions we draw from them. I'm not saying anything one way or the other here. I'm just saying that our "gut" feelings are irrelevant because they're easily misled, and we cannot draw the sort of conclusion you've drawn without actual data.The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it. - Francis Bacon "There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity. — Albert Camus "...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds of variously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." - Barash, David 1995... "Many that live deserve death. And some die that deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then be not too eager to deal out death in the name of justice, fearing for your own safety. Even the wise cannot see all ends." - Gandalf, J. R. R. Tolkien: The Lord Of the Rings
Nihil supernum
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yenmor Member (Idle past 3686 days) Posts: 145 Joined:
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Rahvin writes:
As a matter of fact, no one has data on how many german Nazis wanted to exterminate the Jews. Therefore, we can never conclude that Nazi Germany was a Jew hating state. In fact, from that we can derive that Nazi Germany was an enlightened state that was misunderstood by the evil capitalist and communist world.
I actually have no data on the distribution of racism in either the general population or the Tea Party. Do you actually have that data? Without it, it's impossible to draw the conclusion you've just drawn. Perception is not the same as reality, and our perception of both the prevalence of racism in the general populace and racism in the Tea Party are unlikely to be accurate, simply because of the bias inherent in what is "news" and thus likely to garner media attention. Jim Bob down the street is unlikely to appear on national news outlets even if he's the Grand Wizard of the KKK; Johnny Racist in the Tea Party is more likely to get on TV because he'll show up at the White House for a large rally with a racist sign and a Confederate flag. He doesn't necessarily represent the Tea Party as a whole, but he'll get TV time because he's likely to get an emotional reaction from the viewers and thus push up ratings...and this, without even requiring any sort of intentional deception from anyone, can color our collective perception and introduce bias in the conclusions we draw from them.
We've come full circle on this. And I have to again point to the fact that presidents before Obama spent money like there was no tomorrow. And yet as soon as Obama was elected, an entire political faction was created for the sole purpose of opposing Obama and his supposed future spending spree. I've been a lot of things, including an idiot. But I can still see the obvious racial/racist push for the formation of the tea party. Remember how much Bush spent? Where was the tea party then? We're not just going on our gut feelings here. The tea party has made it abundantly clear that they really really really really hate the one president that has the least spending increases in the last 60 years. PolitiFact | Viral Facebook post says Barack Obama has lowest spending record of any recent president So, which is it? Is the tea party against less spending or is it against a black man in the office?
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
And yet as soon as Obama was elected, an entire political faction was created for the sole purpose of opposing Obama and his supposed future spending spree. You might want to check this chronology. The Tea Party is just a bit older than you imply here.Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) I believe that a scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy.Richard P. Feynman If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9202 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.4 |
The Tea Party is just a bit older than you imply here. Really?
quote: Tea Party movement - Wikipedia Now there is this
quote: But we all know that here was no Tea Party at that time and no organized groups claiming to be a Tea Party until after the 2008 election. If you have other evidence please present it and correct the historical record.Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
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ramoss Member (Idle past 642 days) Posts: 3228 Joined: |
One thign this does not mention is one the think tanks funded by the Koch Brothers had a 'Tea Party' web site out in 2002.
Study: Kochs Tried To Start 'Grassroots' Tea Party In 2002 | Crooks and Liars
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caffeine Member (Idle past 1054 days) Posts: 1800 From: Prague, Czech Republic Joined:
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As a matter of fact, no one has data on how many german Nazis wanted to exterminate the Jews. Therefore, we can never conclude that Nazi Germany was a Jew hating state. In fact, from that we can derive that Nazi Germany was an enlightened state that was misunderstood by the evil capitalist and communist world. This is a silly analogy. We have lots of data on the anti-Jewish nature of the Nazi state, in the form of the legislation it passed and the Jews it murdered. The Nazi State banned Jews from the legal profession and from the civil service. It expelled Jewish officers from the army, forbid Jews to be newspaper editors, and removed all Jewish teachers from public schools. It banned Jews from being vets, auctioneers and arms merchants - it would later ban Jews from owning guns at all. It then confiscated their passports and started seizing their property. This was all before the horrors of the Holocaust really got going. And it wasn't necessary to wait until they got into power and starting enacting these laws to conclude that the party was anti Jewish, since the following appears near the beginning of their 1920 manifesto:
quote: which then goes on to exclude non-citizens (including all Jews) from the right to live in the country and equal protection under the law. The two cases are hardly comparable. Edited by caffeine, : No reason given.
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Jon Inactive Member |
Something tells me this sub-topic no longer has anything to do with defaulting...
Love your enemies! |
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9202 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.4 |
One thign this does not mention is one the think tanks funded by the Koch Brothers had a 'Tea Party' web site out in 2002. But that is not the Tea Party as it exists now. Yes the Koch's tried to start astroturf groups many times, but there was not a Tea Party movement until 2008-2009. Also, most tea partiers will vociferously claim they are not Koch funded or an astro turf group, which completely negates the 2002 Tea Party website as part of this same movement. If the claim is to be made that the current Tea Party movement started earlier than 2008, then an argument needs to be presented showing how it evolved from the ealry Koch astroturf to the 2008-2009 protests. Just claiming there were people or groups using the name earlier doeas not mean it was or is the same movement. There was an American Republican Party from 1843-1854. It was an anti-immigrant party. Does that mean that the Republican Party of today is some how connected?Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
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petrophysics1 Inactive Member |
I supported the appointment of Clarence Thomas to the SCOTUS.
You did not. The ONLY reason you could possibly have for not supporting his appointment is that he is black. Therefore you are a racist and I am not. Strange since I would consider myself part of the Tea Party movement.
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9202 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.4
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I supported the appointment of Clarence Thomas to the SCOTUS. You did not. The ONLY reason you could possibly have for not supporting his appointment is that he is black. Did you follow the hearings at all? Do you remember any racist signs or comments by liberals during the hearings. Ever hear of Anita Hill?
Strange since I would consider myself part of the Tea Party movement. Posse Comitatus too?Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
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Diomedes Member Posts: 996 From: Central Florida, USA Joined:
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Strange since I would consider myself part of the Tea Party movement Did you vote for Bush in 2000 and 2004? And if so, can you explain how you reconcile your fiscal conservatism and notions of non-interventionism with Bush's exploding of the deficit, expansion of Medicare and the starting of two unfunded wars?
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1.61803 Member (Idle past 1534 days) Posts: 2928 From: Lone Star State USA Joined:
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Did you vote for Bush in 2000 and 2004? And if so, can you explain how you reconcile your fiscal conservatism and notions of non-interventionism with Bush's exploding of the deficit, expansion of Medicare and the starting of two unfunded wars? It was A Merkin war on tear!!!!!!"You were not there for the beginning. You will not be there for the end. Your knowledge of what is going on can only be superficial and relative" William S. Burroughs
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Taq Member Posts: 10085 Joined: Member Rating: 5.6
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I supported the appointment of Clarence Thomas to the SCOTUS. You did not. The ONLY reason you could possibly have for not supporting his appointment is that he is black. Therefore you are a racist and I am not. Strange since I would consider myself part of the Tea Party movement.
What I have always found ironic is that Obama is taking Republican policies and feeding them back to the Republicans. Obamacare is the Republican health care reform policy from the 1990's, including the individual mandate and health insurance exchanges. The only reason that I can think of is that Republicans really, really hate Obama for some irrational reason.
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Jon Inactive Member |
What I have always found ironic is that Obama is taking Republican policies and feeding them back to the Republicans. Obamacare is the Republican health care reform policy from the 1990's, including the individual mandate and health insurance exchanges. The only reason that I can think of is that Republicans really, really hate Obama for some irrational reason. Have you considered that the Republican party of today isn't the same as the Republican party of the 90s?Love your enemies!
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frako Member (Idle past 336 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
LOL the European parliament has its whacoes too.
The Romanian representative voted yes on the last 541 votes. He basicaly always votes yes sometimes he abstains but rarely.Even if proposals contradict eachother. Should 50% of a cigaret box be covered by shocking warning pictures? sure Sould 65% of cigarete.... ? Sure Should companies be allowed to pick the place of the picture? Sure Should the pictures be at the bottom half? sure Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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