Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 64 (9164 total)
2 online now:
Newest Member: ChatGPT
Post Volume: Total: 916,902 Year: 4,159/9,624 Month: 1,030/974 Week: 357/286 Day: 13/65 Hour: 1/0


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Misconceptions of E=MC^2
molbiogirl
Member (Idle past 2670 days)
Posts: 1909
From: MO
Joined: 06-06-2007


Message 79 of 243 (452330)
01-30-2008 2:39 AM
Reply to: Message 78 by pelican
01-30-2008 2:27 AM


Re: E=MC2 experiments
What a siily qiestion. What do you expect me to say?
Not so silly when you say something like this ...
Mass has not travelled at that speed and has not been proved to transform into energy.
Mass transforms into energy everyday, as has been mentioned countless times in this thread.
Cavediver also took the time and trouble to explain that mass CANNOT move at the speed of light.
It is really very simple, as RAZD showed earlier. We have measured the energy output of mass turning into energy. And it confirms that the energy released = the mass times the speed of light squared.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 78 by pelican, posted 01-30-2008 2:27 AM pelican has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 81 by pelican, posted 01-30-2008 5:03 AM molbiogirl has not replied

  
molbiogirl
Member (Idle past 2670 days)
Posts: 1909
From: MO
Joined: 06-06-2007


Message 105 of 243 (452528)
01-30-2008 4:27 PM
Reply to: Message 98 by pelican
01-30-2008 8:19 AM


Re: keeping it simple
Thanks but these symbols are way over my head. Can these be expressed in words.
Nonsense.
You just don't want to try.
I know what it's like to sit in a physics lecture and be so gd lost that you're just watching a guy write on a chalkboard.
I felt that way in P Chem today.
But RAZD's explanation is simple, clear and to the point. Every variable is defined, every step is explained.
But maybe I am expecting too much. After all. You were unable to deduce the E = mc2 is equivalent to E/c2 = m.
Oh. And one more thing.
You are aware that particle accelerators create matter from energy now, yes?
(Adding, of course, the necessary caveats re: "creation" that have been mentioned in this thread, e.g. Message 103.)
Edited by molbiogirl, : No reason given.
Edited by molbiogirl, : darn codes

This message is a reply to:
 Message 98 by pelican, posted 01-30-2008 8:19 AM pelican has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 110 by pelican, posted 01-30-2008 7:50 PM molbiogirl has not replied

  
molbiogirl
Member (Idle past 2670 days)
Posts: 1909
From: MO
Joined: 06-06-2007


Message 147 of 243 (453273)
02-01-2008 6:54 PM
Reply to: Message 146 by johnfolton
02-01-2008 6:37 PM


Re: mass * the speed of light squared = energy ?
Like when .6 grams explode are little prisons of excessive energy being released from say those .6 grams not just from the present but from the past, and future?
What on god's green earth does time have to do with E=mc2? Do you see a "t" in there? I don't see a "t" in there.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 146 by johnfolton, posted 02-01-2008 6:37 PM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 148 by johnfolton, posted 02-01-2008 7:23 PM molbiogirl has replied

  
molbiogirl
Member (Idle past 2670 days)
Posts: 1909
From: MO
Joined: 06-06-2007


Message 149 of 243 (453299)
02-01-2008 7:30 PM
Reply to: Message 148 by johnfolton
02-01-2008 7:23 PM


Re: mass * the speed of light squared = energy ?
The formula was based on an object at rest once mass exceeds this it involves time thus relativity, etc...
Wrong.
This mass is the ratio of momentum to velocity, and it is also the relativistic energy divided by c2. So the equation E = mrelc2 holds for moving objects. When the velocity is small, the relativistic mass and the rest mass are almost exactly the same.
E = mc2 either means E = m0c2 for an object at rest, or E = mrelc2 when the object is moving.
Mass—energy equivalence - Wikipedia
Einstein is rolling over in his grave.
E= mc2. Period. If time were a factor, it would have been included in the equation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 148 by johnfolton, posted 02-01-2008 7:23 PM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 150 by johnfolton, posted 02-01-2008 7:51 PM molbiogirl has not replied
 Message 160 by Percy, posted 02-02-2008 9:04 AM molbiogirl has not replied

  
molbiogirl
Member (Idle past 2670 days)
Posts: 1909
From: MO
Joined: 06-06-2007


Message 176 of 243 (453607)
02-03-2008 12:43 PM
Reply to: Message 170 by pelican
02-03-2008 1:28 AM


Re: E=mc^2 = cycle of life?
In a word? No.
I understand basic algebraic equasions. Where I have 'unease' (so to speak)is that E does not represent a number and neither does M.
You understand basic algebra, but you are "uneasy" with variables?
You understand basic algebra, but you were unable to see that E = mc2 is equivalent to E/c2 = m?
You understand basic algebra, but you feel the need to ask "Could they be joined together in a continuous circle reacting one upon the other, thus creating a cyclical equasion that is the theory of everything?"?
Algebraic equaTions are not "cyclical". They are algebraic.
Algebra = the branch of mathematics that uses letters, symbols, and/or characters to represent numbers and express mathematical relationships. Those symbols are called variables.
Einstein was looking for the theory of everything.
Albert Einstein had three great theories. His first theory of Special Relativity (1905) gave us E = mc, which led to the atomic bomb and unlocked the secret of the stars. His second great theory was General Relativity (1915), which gave us space warps, the Big Bang, and black holes. But many don't realize that his greatest theory was never finished: "a theory of everything".
NOVA | The Elegant Universe | A Theory of Everything? | PBS
E = mc2 is NOT the theory of everything.
The theory of everything is also known as the unified field theory.
And there is no unified field theory.
Yet.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 170 by pelican, posted 02-03-2008 1:28 AM pelican has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 178 by pelican, posted 02-03-2008 2:25 PM molbiogirl has not replied

  
molbiogirl
Member (Idle past 2670 days)
Posts: 1909
From: MO
Joined: 06-06-2007


Message 196 of 243 (453723)
02-03-2008 8:45 PM
Reply to: Message 189 by pelican
02-03-2008 5:48 PM


Now this angers me. Do you want to know why? It is all speculation derived from your erronious belief surrounding lay-people. Not very scientific at all.
Nope.
He speaks from experience. And empirical evidence.
I can't even begin to count the number of times the ToE has been denigrated as "just a theory" on this board alone, to say nothing of all those BS creo sites.
You really need to get over yourself.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 189 by pelican, posted 02-03-2008 5:48 PM pelican has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 197 by pelican, posted 02-03-2008 9:02 PM molbiogirl has not replied

  
molbiogirl
Member (Idle past 2670 days)
Posts: 1909
From: MO
Joined: 06-06-2007


Message 203 of 243 (453748)
02-03-2008 10:59 PM
Reply to: Message 192 by pelican
02-03-2008 5:59 PM


Asked and answered. 31 times.
You ask:
Ok, so can this be 'observed' in reality?
Message 2.
It depends on what you mean by "proven". A brazillion experiments have been performed on this, and it has been verified in all of these. In science, that counts as "proven".
Message 4.
So when a scientist says that E=mc2 has been proven, all he means is that the accuracy of the equation is supported by a great deal of empirical evidence.
Message 6.
This is essentially a prediction of Relativity, and it provides a wonderful way to test the theory. If the description of the way the universe works as developed out of the mathematics of the theory then the theory is confirmed as being a useful description of at least part of our universe.
They tested it, the description holds.
Message 14.
Yes, E = mc2 has been directly verified.
Message 16.
Then why don't you just get to the bloody point? E = mc2 has been verified, and Modulus has even cited an experiment that verified it to a high level of accuracy.
Message 19.
I thought you were requesting information regarding an experiment that verifies E=mc2. I provided you with a description of such an experiment.
Message 23.
It has been experimentally verified so what's the beef!?
Message 26.
How much effort have you actually put into looking up the experiments that verify that E=mc2?
Message 28.
If you mean, has the equation been experimentally confirmed, as in, does the equation correlate with reality as tested? Yes. I have given you an example of an experiment that does this directly.
Message 30.
And it has been verified. You actually asked for an example of an experiment where it was verified -- Modulus provided one such experiment, and now you claim that he was off-topic.
Message 38.
It is tested true every second of every day at every nuclear reactor in the world. None of the billion $ particle accelerators in the world would work at all if this equation was not true.
There are very few equations in science that are better tested than this one...
Message 42.
As stated: experiments have confirmed that the equation accurately describes many parts of the universe.
Message 49.
The way I understand it is that many experiments have been done that have measured the amount of energy and mass before, and the amount of energy and mass after, many energy gain\loss events.
Message 79.
Mass transforms into energy everyday, as has been mentioned countless times in this thread.
Message 80.
THAT is the creation of matter (electron/positron pair) from energy, perfectly obeying e=mc^2. This happens billions of times a day at the particle accelerators around the world.
Message 91.
So, just for the record Heinrik, you are contending that every particle factory in the world doesn't actually work, and every particle physicist in the world is lying, and hiding a huge conspiracy that we have never observed pair creation.
Message 93.
Conversion of energy to mass is happening inside your body all the time.
Message 99.
The equivalence has been experimentally verified in both directions. The conversion of energy to mass is much more difficult because such huge amounts of energy are necessary to create very little mass.
Message 102.
You seem to have doubts that it has been experimentally confirmed. So, if you would be so kind as to answer the question: Would you agree that if we were to measure, e, m, and c and we were to find that e=mc2 that would confirm the equation was accurate?
Message 103.
Now you are also asking can this work backwards? Can energy be converted into mass? The answer is yes...
Message 105.
You are aware that particle accelerators create matter from energy now, yes?
Message 107.
cavediver already did in Message 80 where he linked to this page.
Message 109.
Now Einstein has described a universe where something can have a velocity of zero and still have energy. That is a big claim. So we measured this prediction. It turned out to be true.
Message 113.
One thing you could do is increase the velocity of something. This will increase the amount of energy that something has. If e=mc2 is true, we should find that the mass of the something will also increase. This has been done, incidentally.
Message 115.
Do you agree we can test whether e=mc2 is actually an accurate description of the real world by measuring the real world values of e, m and c and seeing how they are related?
Message 121.
You see it happen all the time, since this is the basis for microwave ovens and laser, such as those in your DVD drive.
Message 128.
It is an incredible amount of energy. And we've measured it, and confirmed that it is an incredible amount of energy.
Message 136.
For those who find themselves incredulous at the amount of energy the equation E=MC^2 says is released when matter is converted into energy...there's your proof, right there.
Message 138.
So, if the application of the formula to the amount of material used up at Hiroshima results in the amount of energy which would be required to do exactly what was done at Hiroshima, (avoiding what was done at Hiroshima to determine what that amount of energy would do cos otherwise we get circular again)then we have an application of the formula where it has been tested in the real world and found to be accurate, something that Heinrik is asking for.
Message 173.
No matter how you rearrange the equation, it states exactly the same thing. What it says has been exhaustively tested and found to be correct.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 192 by pelican, posted 02-03-2008 5:59 PM pelican has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 209 by pelican, posted 02-04-2008 4:07 AM molbiogirl has not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024