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Member (Idle past 94 days) Posts: 10333 From: London England Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Rationalising The Irrational - Hardcore Theists Apply Within | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
jar writes: What you are is irrelevant. It has no bearing whatsoever on the existence or non-existence of any God. Matt 16:13-18 writes: NIV- When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, "Who do people say the Son of Man is?" 14 They replied, "Some say John the Baptist; others say Elijah; and still others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets." 15 "But what about you?" he asked. "Who do you say I am?" 16 Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God." 17 Jesus replied, "Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by man, but by my Father in heaven. Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Whoever trusts in his own mind is a fool, but he who walks in wisdom will be delivered.~Proverbs 28:26
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Why do you keep asking irrelevant questions? To get you to tell me who you represent. For the record, I'll just mark down that you say its irrelevant. Or I can ask you again. Who do you represent in these discussions? Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Whoever trusts in his own mind is a fool, but he who walks in wisdom will be delivered.~Proverbs 28:26
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
What does matter, and is very clear, is that a path without verification is a path of gullibility. A real, good God would not create such a path where His loyal followers could so easily be taken unawares by any other trickster. And I would agree. So about verification....Who Do You Represent?Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Whoever trusts in his own mind is a fool, but he who walks in wisdom will be delivered.~Proverbs 28:26
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
In any discussion related to things without factual evidence to support a position I can only represent myself.
Is it possible to belong to a club and ignore certain bylaws since the bylaws have no evidence? (Yes) Is it right to call yourself an Elk without believing in the Elk bylaws? Is it more honest to represent the Elks when talking about what the club stands for or to represent yourself? (The Elks)Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Whoever trusts in his own mind is a fool, but he who walks in wisdom will be delivered.~Proverbs 28:26
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0
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If the Elks accept you as an Elk, you're an Elk. If you disregard the bylaws, it's up to them to decide whether to dehorn you or not. In your case they likely would keep you around for comic relief. Edited by Phat, : added sentenceChance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Whoever trusts in his own mind is a fool, but he who walks in wisdom will be delivered.~Proverbs 28:26
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
One of the better counter-arguments to this quote is known as Russell’s Teapot
Essentially the counter-argument is that absence of evidence is not always evidence of absence. quote: The link goes on to explain the life of Jesus as further evidence. The author concludes Or... we might point our metaphorical telescopes the other way, write articles about how ridiculous the idea is, and tell everyone that since there is no evidence, we refuse to believe it. The bottom line(in my mind) is not the proof itself. It is the necessity for such proof and the openness of the human heart to receive such an idea. Edited by Phat, : fixed breakageChance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Whoever trusts in his own mind is a fool, but he who walks in wisdom will be delivered.~Proverbs 28:26
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0
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You may have a point. I'll take it into consideration.
Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Whoever trusts in his own mind is a fool, but he who walks in wisdom will be delivered.~Proverbs 28:26
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
jar writes: What I mean is that the public reaction to the death, burial, and reported resurrection of Jesus is much greater than most others who have died. How is the life of Jesus evidence of anything more than say the life of Don Diego de la Vega? Does a reaction count as evidence?Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Whoever trusts in his own mind is a fool, but he who walks in wisdom will be delivered.~Proverbs 28:26
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Tangle writes: For supernatural, call GHOSTBUSTERS. So now that's sorted who we gonna call?
For Humor call either Ringo or Charles Schultz For answers as to why it all sounds like meaningless cliches, try this:
1 Cor 1:19 writes:
For it is written: "I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate." Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Whoever trusts in his own mind is a fool, but he who walks in wisdom will be delivered.~Proverbs 28:26
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
would you say that the Bible itself sounds like meaningless cliches? In general, that is?
I really had the urge to ask someone in my family if they can explain what was just said. I suspected that they wouldn't be able to. I suspect that no one would be able to. However, since they are being cool with my whole kitten-eating atheism, I didn't push it. Still has me curious if they could explain what was said, but I suspect it will always remain a curiosity. Give me an example of something said that is meaningless and I'll see if I can explain it. Edited by Phat, : No reason given.Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Whoever trusts in his own mind is a fool, but he who walks in wisdom will be delivered.~Proverbs 28:26
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Theodoric writes:
The article covered this:
There is no historical evidence for any of this. None. There are the writings included in the bible, nothing else. The writings in the bible are of no value historically to show the historical existence of this character.The author concludes Or... we might point our metaphorical telescopes the other way, write articles about how ridiculous the idea is, and tell everyone that since there is no evidence, we refuse to believe it. The whole idea is based on faith. There never was meant to be evidence. But if you prefer, you can have faith that Donald Trump will make America great again or that there is no such thing as sin and this world will someday suddenly learn how to get along. I would never squash such hope. Why is it that men such as Richard Carrier attempt to spread misinformation and attempt to squash the faith of Christians?Of course our faith will never be quenched even if they burned every Bible and religious tract on the planet. Christians won't disappear... Teach your children well because some of their friends will always be believers. Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Whoever trusts in his own mind is a fool, but he who walks in wisdom will be delivered.~Proverbs 28:26
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Greg Boyd, eh? I can google the sermon and even the Bible reference, but lets do something different. Pretend that I am an associate Pastor at your families church. You see me and we briefly chat and shake hands. You ask me if I have a few minutes to talk and I say sure, lets go into the cafe. So here we are.(we just had coffee...you offered to buy, but I beat you to it!
So perhaps your question sounds something like this: "Phat, to be honest with you, that sermon today by guest speaker Greg Boyd made absolutely no sense to me." It sounded like a string of meaningless cliches and pious platitudes. Am I missing something?" Does that sound right so far? Edited by Phat, : editChance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Whoever trusts in his own mind is a fool, but he who walks in wisdom will be delivered.~Proverbs 28:26
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Please explain how it isn't a bunch of meaningless phrases and platitudes. Im not sure that I don't actually agree with you. What I was trying to do, however, is to engage you in a conversation about whether the texts out of the Bible upon which the sermon was based were meaningless. If so, I suppose the discussion is stalled at that point.Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Whoever trusts in his own mind is a fool, but he who walks in wisdom will be delivered.~Proverbs 28:26
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
I looked at the material that Boyd used as well as the scripture. I just was not feeling it and in fact see your point. Itr does sound meaningless!
But then I am at Day 80 of sobriety and am getting prepared for some serious mental brain healing. It will be interesting whether I will become more or less of a zealot once my brain changes. I dont doubt my faith....just my logic.Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Whoever trusts in his own mind is a fool, but he who walks in wisdom will be delivered.~Proverbs 28:26
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