the new and improved obama thread

Juggs writes:What I have seen is some liberal accolytes (sic) claiming that this type of behavior as being authentic African heritage. LOL! Yeah right! Just like how Kwanza is authentic, I'm sure.

Juggs writes:you mean invent strawmen and argue with yourself.

Brenna writes:they're just lazy, culturally. i see. also, why don't you demonstrate your claim.

Juggs writes:Indians, living in abject squalor, statistically fair better than the richest of little suburbanite white kids. Why? Because their culture has not been corrupted by the slothful, indifferent American attitude that now pervades the country.

Juggs writes:What I notice is that people in that business want a person who is reliable, who isn't so ghetto that they devalue the entire block.

I just lived in the ghetto for 3 years! I finally got out. Maybe you should live in the ghetto. You sure wouldn't feel sorry for all the people there, because it would become instantly apparent that many of them have allowed themselves to languish there. Not all, certainly, but a very, very high percentage.

"The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing 'God Bless America.' No, no, no, God damn America, that's in the Bible for killing innocent people," he said in a 2003 sermon. "God damn America for treating our citizens as less than human. God damn America for as long as she acts like she is God and she is supreme."

"We bombed Hiroshima, we bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye," Rev. Wright said in a sermon on Sept. 16, 2001."We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians and black South Africans, and now we are indignant because the stuff we have done overseas is now brought right back to our own front yards. America's chickens are coming home to roost," he told his congregation.

JERRY FALWELL: And I agree totally with you that the Lord has protected us so wonderfully these 225 years. And since 1812, this is the first time that we've been attacked on our soil and by far the worst results. And I fear, as Donald Rumsfeld, the Secretary of Defense, said yesterday, that this is only the beginning. And with biological warfare available to these monsters -- the Husseins, the Bin Ladens, the Arafats -- what we saw on Tuesday, as terrible as it is, could be miniscule if, in fact -- if, in fact -- God continues to lift the curtain and allow the enemies of America to give us probably what we deserve.PAT ROBERTSON: Jerry, that's my feeling. I think we've just seen the antechamber to terror. We haven't even begun to see what they can do to the major population.JERRY FALWELL: The ACLU's got to take a lot of blame for this.PAT ROBERTSON: Well yes.JERRY FALWELL: And, I know that I'll hear from them for this. But, throwing God out successfully with the help of the federal court system, throwing God out of the public square, out of the schools. The abortionists have got to bear some burden for this because God will not be mocked. And when we destroy 40 million little innocent babies, we make God mad. I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People For the American Way -- all of them who have tried to secularize America -- I point the finger in their face and say "you helped this happen."PAT ROBERTSON: Well, I totally concur, and the problem is we have adopted that agenda at the highest levels of our government. And so we're responsible as a free society for what the top people do. And, the top people, of course, is the court system..JERRY FALWELL: Pat, did you notice yesterday the ACLU and all the Christ-haters, People For the American Way, NOW, etc. were totally disregarded by the Democrats and the Republicans in both houses of Congress as they went out on the steps and called out on to God in prayer and sang "God Bless America" and said "let the ACLU be hanged". In other words, when the nation is on its knees, the only normal and natural and spiritual thing to do is what we ought to be doing all the time - calling upon God. ~~~PAT ROBERTSON: Amen

ROBERTSON: You know, it's just amazing, though, that people say the litmus test for [Supreme Court nominee John G.] Roberts [Jr.] is whether or not he supports the wholesale slaughter of unborn children. We have killed over 40 million unborn babies in America. I was reading, yesterday, a book that was very interesting about what God has to say in the Old Testament about those who shed innocent blood. And he used the term that those who do this, "the land will vomit you out." That -- you look at your -- you look at the book of Leviticus and see what it says there. And this author of this said, "well 'vomit out' means you are not able to defend yourself." But have we found we are unable somehow to defend ourselves against some of the attacks that are coming against us, either by terrorists or now by natural disaster? Could they be connected in some way? And he goes down the list of the things that God says will cause a nation to lose its possession, and to be vomited out. And the amazing thing is, a judge has now got to say, "I will support the wholesale slaughter of innocent children" in order to get confirmed to the bench. And I am sure Judge Roberts is not going to say any such thing. But nevertheless, that's the litmus test that's being put on, the very thing that could endanger our nation. And it's very interesting. Read the bible, read Leviticus, see what it says there.

Television evangelist Pat Robertson suggested Thursday that Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's stroke was divine retribution for the Israeli withdrawal from Gaza, which Robertson opposed."He was dividing God's land, and I would say, 'Woe unto any prime minister of Israel who takes a similar course to appease the [European Union], the United Nations or the United States of America,'" Robertson told viewers of his long-running television show, "The 700 Club.""God says, 'This land belongs to me, and you'd better leave it alone,'" he said.

Stereotyping is among the most common form of anti-Semitism. This is evidenced by the words of many well-known Christian leaders, among them the Rev. Bailey Smith. "I don't know why God chose the Jew," Smith said. "They have such funny noses."2Outward appearance, though, is not the only way some leaders characterize Jews. The Rev. Dan C. Fore, former head of the Moral Majority in New York, said, "I love the Jewish people deeply. God has given them talents He has not given others. They are His chosen people. Jews have a God-given ability to make money...They control the media, they control this city."3"A few of you don't like the Jews and I know why," said the Rev. Jerry Falwell. "He [sic] can make more money accidently than you can make on purpose."4

A second form of anti-Semitism involves missionary activity directed at Jews. Many conservative Christian leaders hold the view that Judaism is an invalid religion, that Jews who don't believe in Jesus are "unsaved" or "incomplete." The offensiveness of this type of anti-Semitism should be obvious, but often goes unnoticed."It's interesting at great political rallies," preached the Rev. Bailey Smith, "how you have a Protestant to pray, a Catholic to pray, and then you have a Jew to pray. With all due respect to those dear people, my friends, God Almighty does not hear the prayer of a Jew. For how in the world can God hear the prayer of a man who says that Jesus Christ is not the true Messiah? That is blasphemy."5The Rev. Jerry Falwell sanctioned this viewpoint in his book, Listen, America! "The Jews are returning to their land of unbelief. They are spiritually blind and desperately in need of their Messiah and Savior. Yet they are God's people, and in the world today Bible-believing Christians are the best friends the nation Israel has."6Pat Robertson, too, thinks of Jews as "spiritually deaf" and "spiritually blind." In the end times, Robertson believes, Jews will be brought in as "offerings to the Lord."7 He predicts mass conversions of Jews to Christianity, and toward this end, Robertson built a Christian radio station in Lebanon to beam the Gospel into the Jewish state, which Fundamentalists believe will eventually be inherited by Christians. For the present, Jews occupy the land as caretakers.

The rising star of the Christian Identity movement is Pastor Pete Peters of the LaPorte (Colorado) Church of Christ. Peters distributes The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion and is the author of the booklets The Real Hate Group and Death Penalty for Homosexuals Is Prescribed in the Bible. Peters ” along with Ted Pike (producer of an anti-Semitic video called "The Other Israel"), other Christian Identity ministers, and the Rev. Donald Wildmon ” is a popular personality on LogoPlex.Peters' The Real Hate Group depicts Jews as controlling television, the film industry, and the news media. It describes the Anti-Defamation League (ADL) as "the most dangerous hate group in America." Like the Bottom Feeder joke book published by Life Dynamics, The Real Hate Group characterizes Jews as having large noses.Peters is significant because he has crossed the line between Christian Identity and more mainstream conservative Christian groups. Besides broadcasting nationally on short-wave radio, he can be seen on the fast-growing Keystone Inspiration Network, of Red Lion, Pennsylvania. This cable TV network is picked up in about 120 cities. Described as a "family" network, it carries Pat Robertson's "700 Club," Jerry Falwell's "Old Time Gospel Hour," Morris Cerullo, James Robison, Benny Hinn, and other popular evangelical Christian programming.

In his published writings, especially his 1991 book The New World Order, Pat Robertson has propagated theories about a worldwide Jewish conspiracy. Michael Land raised the issue in February in the New York Times Book Review, and in April Jacob Heilbrun, writing in the New York Review of Books, cited chapter and verse of Robertson's borrowings from well-known anti-Semitic works.[14]

Robertson's tome The New World Order was described as a 'catch all for conspiracy theories' by Christian academic Don Wilkey:Pat Robertson’s work, NEW WORLD ORDER, is a catch all for conspiracy theories. It combines the paranoia of the Old Right with modern versions. A summary of Robertson’s book is found on page 177 in which Pat says a conspiracy has existed in the world working through Freemasonry and a secret Order of the Illuminati, a group combining Masons and Jewish Bankers.[13]

Michael Land raised the issue in February in the New York Times Book Review, and in April Jacob Heilbrun, writing in the New York Review of Books, cited chapter and verse of Robertson's borrowings from well-known anti-Semitic works.

Buz writes:... Pat and Jerry (do not) implicate blacks 23 years for ruining the nation, ending bloody WWII with what it took to do it (saving lives in the long run) or calling for damnation on America.

With funding from Jewish financiers, the Illuminati/Masons caused the French Revolution. As Robertson describes it:The slaughter that followed was not merely an assault on the king and the aristocracy - what was called the ancien regime - it was an assault against everyone, even the leaders of the Reign of Terror that followed on the heels of the revolution. The satanic carnage that the Illuminati brought to France was the clear predecessor of the bloodbaths and successive party purges visited on the Soviet Union by the communists under both Lenin and Stalin.Then the Illuminati/Masons - with Jewish money, of course - incited the European revolutions of 1848.

Marx and Engels, though, were given direction by another Jew, who happened also to be one of the early advocates of a Jewish state: "The precise connecting link between the German Illuminati and the beginning of world communism was furnished by a German radical named Moses Hess" (p. 69). (Note Robertson's use here, as in his descriptions of other Jews later, of the adjective "German" rather than "Jewish." This does not necessarily mean much, since the adjective "German" or "European" frequently refers to Jews in the American literature of anti-Semitism.) Just as the Rothschilds presided over the marriage of Illuminism and Freemasonry, so Moses Hess, the secret Illuminist, is the true father of world communism. This is the first mention in Robertson's book of that longstanding anti-Semitic myth, the Judeo-Bolshevik conspiracy. It is not the last.

The money barons of Europe, who had established privately owned central banks like the Bank of England, found in war the excuse to make large loans to sovereign nations from money that they created out of nothing to be repaid by taxes from the people of the borrowing nations. The object of the lenders was to stimulate government deficit spending and subsequent borrowing. War served that purpose nicely, but from 1945 to 1990 the full mobilization for the Cold War and the resultant massive national borrowings accompanied the result just as well without a full-scale shooting war. [p. 122, emphasis added]Yes, according to Robertson, even the Cold War was part of the Big Jewish Plot.

2. Last evening I listened to the Mark Levin show. There are more segments to the tapes than what ABC cited. On the UTube you can hear some of the others. In one of them Wright stated that rich whites are the ones responsible for running this country thus implicating whites for the reason for America to be damned. I was thinking this was on the ABC segment as well but after listening again I see it isn't on that segment.

3. The anti-Semitism is implicated by that fact that Wright traveled to Lybia with Louis Farrakan and awarded Louis Farrakan for his contribution to society. Of course we all should be aware that Farrakan and the Nation of Islam is very anti-Semitic. Obama has chosen to be closely associated with this preacher who has been spewing this hatred for a long time.

4. This nonsense that Obama doesn't agree with all this racism and anti-Semitism doesn't wash. As Mark Levin correctly states, Obama along with his wife and children has been listening to this hateful racist propaganda preached to his congregation for many years. Then he equates him to an uncle who gets carried away. Nonsense! (abe: As Mark put it,) one doesn't choose who's his uncle. One chooses one's mentor and pastor for his family because he likes his ideals and his preaching.

2. You can go here and access all of the tapes relative to what I've been claiming.

Bush and his family HAVE been working in oil (among other things) with the Saudi Royal family for many years (IIRC more than 23), as well as the Taliban.

Mobiogirl, I believe you can access all of the tapes at this site, some of which will fill the ticket. Let me know if it doesn't work for you and I'll try to come up with what is needed to substantiate my claims.

Mobiogirl, count the number of times in the first tape which Wright says the word's black and white. It's rhetorical rampant racist rant.

... who cares about what a poor black man has to face every day in a country and a culture controlled by rich white peoples.Somebody missed that. Somebody got nervous cause somebody remembered that.I am still in Bible country. I am still in the text. Jesus was a poor black man who lived in a country and who lived in a culture that was controlled by rich white people. The Romans were rich, the Romans were Italian, which mean they were European which means they were white - and the Romans ran everything in Jesus’ country.It just came to me with -- within the past few weeks, you all, why so many folk are hating on Barack Obama. He doesn't fit the model. He ain't white. He ain't rich. And he ain't privileged. Hillary fits the mold. Europeans fit the mold. Guiliani fits the mold. Rich white men fit the mold.Hillary never had a cab whiz past her and not pick her up becauseher skin was the wrong color. Hillary never had to worry about being pulled over in her car as a black man driving in the wrong neighborhood.I am sick of negroes who just do not get it.Hillary was not a black boy raised in a single-parent home. Barack was. Barack knows what it means to be a black man living in a country and a culture that is controlled by rich white people. Hillary can never know that. Hillary ain't never been called a nigger. Hillary has never had her people defined as a non-persons.Hillary ain't had to work twice as hard just to get accepted by rich white folk who run everything or to get a passing grade when you know you are smarter than that C student in the White House.Oh I am so glad I have a god who knows what it means to be a poor black man in a country and a culture that is controlled by and run by rich white people.He taught me, Jesus did, how to love my enemies. Jesus taught me to love the hell out of my enemies. And not be reduced to their level of hatred, bigotry, and small-mindedness.Hillary ain't never had her own people say she wasn't white enough.Jesus had his own people siding with the enemy. That's why I love Jesus y'all. He never let their hatred dampen his hope. There is a name that I love to hear, I love to sing his words ...

Wright insists that America is and always has been run by rich white folks. That's just racist rhetoric. America has had many congressmen, senators, cabinet members and judges who are not white and who are not rich. Much of this has been the case for 200 plus years. How then can you say that Wright's hate and racist speech is not racist?

wiki writes:The Black Caucus has grown steadily as more black members have been elected. In 1969 the Caucus had 9 members. As of 2007, it had 41 members. Currently, Illinois Senator Barack Obama is the only black member of the U.S. Senate.

In the 435-member House of Representatives, 123 elected officials earned at least one million dollars last year, according to recently released financial records made public each year.

Next door in the Senate, whose blue-blooded pedigree includes a Kennedy and a Rockefeller, one in three people are millionaires.

What site?Furthermore, I am not your research assistant.You need to support your absurd claims with EVIDENCE.Do so or retract your slanderous nonsense.

...count the number of times in the first tape which Wright says the word's black and white ...

If you can't discern racism in just the segment which you cited, you're blind to what racism is.

Have you figured out exactly how many rich white people have run this country since it's inception, including all segments of government?

Wright should know that during the days of slavery in America and all through human history slavery has been a fact of life.

Can you imagine the outcry if Falwell's church engaged in all of that? Why hasn't Obama been decrying that during this past decade of his political career?

NYT writes:Financial records show that the Rev. Jerry Falwell has transferred over $6.7 million from his political contributors to his religious ministries in the past three years, The News & Daily Advance of Lynchburg says.

Mobiogirl, this isn't the Civil Rights days.

Two of the country's foremost researchers on race and capital punishment, law professor David Baldus and statistician George Woodworth, along with colleagues in Philadelphia, have conducted a careful analysis of race and the death penalty in Philadelphia which reveals that the odds of receiving a death sentence are nearly four times (3.9) higher if the defendant is black. These results were obtained after analyzing and controlling for case differences such as the severity of the crime and the background of the defendant. The data were subjected to various forms of analysis, but the conclusion was clear: blacks were being sentenced to death far in excess of other defendants for similar crimes.

Public schools in the United States are becoming more racially segregated and the trend is likely to accelerate because of a Supreme Court decision in June, according to report published Wednesday.

Section I: Racial Steering, Closed Doors, and Lost Homes: Documenting Housing
Discrimination and its Roots....................................................................................................5
Real Estate Sales Discrimination.........................................................................................5
Rental Discrimination in the Wake of Hurricane Katrina............................................17
Other Fair Housing Concerns in 2006...............................................................................17Section II: Housing Discrimination Complaints for 2006................................................26Section III: A Broken System - Enforcement of the Fair Housing Act..........................30
Addressing Less than One Percent of Violations...........................................................30
Case Study: Racial Discrimination...................................................................................34
Federal Obligation to “Affirmatively Further Fair Housing”.....................................34
Fair Housing Initiatives Program: Private Efforts Are Underfunded........................36

Again - this is very difficult to discuss without a full transcript of what Rev. Wright actually said.

I'm not so sure about that. As a white male who grew up in an environment where I never even met a non-white, non-Christian until I was 12 years old, and lived even after that in primarily "white" areas, I didn't think racism was a very large problem either. Then I spent a year in the South, and worked with a few black individuals - it's really appalling when you start to see, with your own eyes, how large a problem racism is.