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Member (Idle past 2979 days) Posts: 4854 From: Dark Side of the Moon Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Obama supports Ground Zero mosque. Religious freedom or is he being too PC? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
Building the mosque "is a deliberately provocative act that will precipitate more bloodshed in the name of Allah," the group claimed. Yeah, nothing provokes Muslims more than being allowed to build mosques. You'd think if it annoyed them that much they could just stop building mosques, but you know what religious folks are like. I predict wave after wave of Islamic suicide bombers demanding that American Muslims be stripped of their First Amendment rights. I note the article ends with the news that a Florida church is organizing a book-burning. This might conciliate them somewhat, but it hardly amounts to the governmental suppression of their religion that these fanatics are apparently prepared to kill and die for. And now back to the real world for the weather.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
Well, if you want a better analogy, is it OK to build a church in Salem? There seem to be 27 of them, which some might think tasteless.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
the muslims are not dumb and they would know that seeking permission to build near ground zero would cause problems. How would they know that? There've been mosques near Ground Zero for years and no-one complained, let alone tried to turn it into a national issue. Of course, if the wingnuts had complained previously, it would have been the Blessed Saint George who'd have been explaining that the President doesn't have the power to cut the First Amendment out of the Constitution with his special Executive Scissors, and so back then it was in no-one's interest to make a fuss about it; just as no-one was demonstrating against high taxes until Obama lowered them; and just as no-one cared about "czars" until Obama followed the example of every other recent President by appointing them.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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ahh the nitpickers and over-literalists, where would we be without them? If it wasn't for people pointing out the facts, you'd still be just as wrong. But at least you'd have some sort of an excuse for it.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
Agreed. But since it was American's insulting Muslims, Obama didn't speak up about it. He didn't make it a government issue, like he has in the case of the mosque. He was asked about the mosque. And he replied that it was not a government issue.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
Well, you know, Americans love Muslims, it's really too bad that 9/11 victims and their families aren't more popular and widely regarded, they just can't get a fair shake around here, huh? Well played, sir, well played.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
Did anyone notice the name? I posted the information about building a mosque on the church in Cordoba, Spain as a symbol of taking that territory. Or because, being Muslims, they wanted a mosque. For which reason (according to every source I can find) they bought the land on which the half-built church stood in what would probably have been an even better expression of naked military triumphalism if they'd just, y'know ... taken it.
Is it just a coincidence that this mosque is also named Cordoba? Well, it could be because the group building the center is called the Cordoba Initiative. Or is that just a coincidence? Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
For reasons which are obvious enough, people celebrate what was good of its time.
If someone named something after Thomas Jefferson, then we'd suppose that they were in favor of freedom and democracy rather than slavery and the disenfranchisement of women. If someone named something after Isaac Newton, we'd suppose that they were in favor of math and science rather than alchemy and Biblical hermeneutics. And if someone names something after Cordoba, we may suppose that they are celebrating tolerance and multiculturalism rather than the jizya, since of its day Cordoba was a shining example of how people of different faiths could get along. If I was to object that since I know more physics than Newton and am a better libertarian than Jefferson and a stronger supporter of the Free Exercise Clause than some Andalusian emir, all three institutions should be named after me, this would be missing the point rather. Anyone can be of their time, it's being ahead of one's time that's the trick. "If I have seen further, it is by standing on the shoulders of giants."
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
Right, because Muslims are so dominant in US society. That's why everything is shut down on Fridays ... N.B: for Muslims, Friday is a day when they're obliged to participate in communal rather than individual prayer; but it is not supposed to be kept as a day of rest like the Jewish Sabbath.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
Until I see people protesting the building of a deli or an insurance branch near ground zero ... Or the strip clubs and the betting parlor. Hallowed ground, y'know. Well, kinda hallowed. Hallowed-ish. Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
Not sure if it was discussed, but did anyone say that the planned opening date for the Mosque was supposed to be 9/11/11? A number of people have said that. There's even a name for these people. They're called "liars".
As I mentioned before, I am for letting them build a Mosque, but I should also add, that if they are constructing some kind of Shrine to what happened there, then I am obviously not for it. Plans do involve a memorial to the victims. Which is obviously just evil.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
I was assuming that this particular group of Muslims would be under the watchful eye of homeland security ... More like hand in hand with them:
Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf is a founder of Cordoba Initiative and serves as its board chair [...] At the FBI’s request after 9/11, he provided cultural training to hundreds of its agents, and the U.S. State Department under presidents George W. Bush and Barak Obama has invited him on several extended overseas speaking tours to represent a positive view of the United States and build international respect for our nation.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
Listen, there is nothing wrong with questioning the motives of Muslims, since it was Muslims who declared Jihad on us. Of course I do not believe that every Muslim believes that all infidels should die. But they are taught to lie to us, and keep the truth to themselves. What does that leave us to think about them? How do we differentiate? "By their fruits shall ye know them."
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
Listen, there is nothing wrong with questioning the motives of Muslims, since it was Muslims who declared Jihad on us. Of course I do not believe that every Muslim believes that all infidels should die. But they are taught to lie to us, and keep the truth to themselves. What does that leave us to think about them? How do we differentiate? The same question would surely apply not just to people who say they're moderate Muslims but to people who say they're not Muslims at all. Like you.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 312 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
Which means absolutely nothing. Actually, it does mean something. It means that the FBI has checked them out, that the State Department under Bush has checked them out, and that the State Department under Obama has checked them out.
It is a terrorists job to hide in plain sight. So, are you, or are you not, a secret Muslim terrorist? Of course, you appear not to be, but it is your job to hide in plain sight, and you haven't been checked out by the FBI and two successive State Departments.
WTF is the problem? If they are clean, they have nothing to worry about. You seem to be implying that you said that they should be checked out further and I demurred. This is not the case. If Homeland Security think them worth looking over one more time, then let them do so.
People get investigated all the dam time, over stupid shit. there obviously is a stir, and it should be governments job to calm the people down. Make sure, this way there can be no " I told you so" Two successive governments have apparently investigated the question, and yet people are not calm.
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