Morality without god

Well you've chosen a few answers and I agree with some of them.Others will agree and disagree with both you and me.But the point is, there are no 'right' answers to these sorts of questions, there's just answers.That's why we have such diffulty with some issues like euthenasia, abortion, execution, torture and so on - we can only go with what we feel is right within the cultural we live in.We can't calculate the right answer because a lot of morality is subjective and developmental. Absolute it ain't.(Btw - the pregnant lady is unconcious awaiting a decision.)Edited by Tangle, : No reason given.

I thought we'd got beyond this.Morality is not only about not doing harm, it's also about doing some good.We not only have a moral duty not to drown the man, we also have the duty to save him from drowning. This is where you tie yourself in knots.It shouldn't matter whose wife and daughter are involved - that's the subjective viewpoint again - according to you it should only matter if the final outcome is a net less harm gain.It doesn't work does it?Edited by Tangle, : No reason given.

It's not going to be worth my while pointing out yet again, that there is now way to objectively measure this is there?(If there was, you would have been able to answer the question I set you earlier in a way that isn't subjective.)

No. My objection is with the entire idea that morality can be objectively measured. It can't be. No. There is no formulae and no values that you can plug in. This is completely wrong headed. Morality is not a function of how much pain a human brain feels. If for no other reason that it completely omits the concept of doing the right things not simply avoiding doing the wrong things.

Two moral questions in the news just now.1. Should a fooballer be paid 100,000 per week?2.the American tennis player 'Georgeous Gussie' died yesterday.Her outfit drew considerable attention; reporters covering the event began calling her "Gorgeous Gussie",[5] and photographers fought for positions where they could get low shots of Moran,[5] with the hope of glimpsing the lace.[1] The event scandalized Wimbledon officials,[6] prompting a debate in Parliament.[1] Moran, who was accused of bringing 'vulgarity and sin into tennis' by the committee of the All England Lawn Tennis and Croquet Club,[1] later reverted to wearing shorts.[2] Tinling, who had acted as official Wimbledon host for 23 years, was shunned for the 33 years following the incident (he was invited back to Wimbledon in 1982).[7][8][9]Where was the harm in wearing a short skirt? And why don't we care now?

How does your sense of empathy work with the frilly knickers question and would your wife feel the same?Edited by Tangle, : No reason given.

Best to take 2 asprins and wait awhile - I'm sure Dogmafood will be along in a minute with a simple formulae to solve it all for us :-)

Why on earth is this a challenge? It's an absolutely normal human condition that has nothing to do with 'spirits'.

I see you've given up on argument and are forced to simply pronounce and pontificate. You can't explain how why morality is not absolute the way it must be if you're beliefs are true, so you prosthelytise; the snake oil seller's retreat.You probably don't realise how profoundly patronising and insulting the things you say are. So, as a good Christian and seeking no harm, I forgive you.

Which really just demonstrates that morality is subjective and changes over time and between cultures.......

Just sayin' 'cos Dogmafood seems to disagree.

There's no agreement that normative morality logically exists, let alone actually exists.The whole idea is a pile of mental masterbation. Absolute it certainly ain't.Meanwhile we do what we can in the society and codes of practices that it has adopted.

But you can't even do it now. There are no right answers to many moral questions.How does the robot decide the problems we've spoken about? Ticking time bomb torture, state execution of criminals, short skirts, footballer's pay, abortion, gay marriage.... etc etc etc?It's exactly the same problem.

Miracles apparently happen.... Well yes, our personal survival depends on our membership of a tribe - and these days a society. We have therefore evolved social skills to make that possible. Just like chimps and to a different degree, termites.

Hi, welcome GrimSqueakerThis thread has been quiet for a while, maybe you can bring it back to life. Sadly I can't help, as I agree with you :-)