Israel/Lebanon/Gaza conflict (continuation thread)

The actual FACT is only that a ceasefire CALLED "humanitarian" was offered and Israel turned it down. I'm sure as Buz is that they turned it down for excellent strategic reasons, knowing the duplicitous nature of it. But if enough world opinion like yours goes against Israel, they may be once again forced, as they have been time and time again, to give in to it, and as usual it will turn out to be an arrangement that is intended to put them at a disadvantage under cover of humanitarian claims. Just the usual disinformation game against Israel.

Please listen to the link I posted. I do not know the situation in Ireland well enough to comment, but what's going on in Lebanon is that a criminal organization is being treated as legitimate in a way that supports them against Israel.

No you misstate the facts again. The only fact is that a ceasefire that is only ALLEGEDLY for humanitarian aid etc has been offered.Oh but there is another fact. Israel's turning it down is being spun by you and others as something reprehensible on their part purely on the basis of what is merely a call for an ALLEGED humanitarian ceasefire. You don't know the real reason for their turning it down but you don't mind insinuating that they are at fault.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

More simple assertion and speculation Faith.Fact is:A ceasefire was offered.Israel turned it down.Thems the facts. All else is just your assertion and speculation.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

See Message 139Thems the facts Faith.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Well SOMETHING I said must have hit home because I see you've dropped the "humanitarian" claim. Without it, yes, those are facts. A ceasefire was offered and Israel turned it down.

And whats wrong with the fact that Israel turned down a ceasefire? That civilians are getting killed?Let me guess: "Thems the facts and the world will make up its own mind"

Nope, haven't dropped it Faith, just redundant. I get tired of typing the same stuff over and over to those who are without ears.Facts are that a ceasefire for humanitarian reasons and to allow for a possible diplomatic resolution was offered and Israel turned it down.Thems the facts Faith.All the rest of the stuff you and Buz have posted is just assertion and speculation.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

No Jar. Thats something someone asserted was the reason. Are you saying now that because someone says something that it is a fact?

Read what the UN proposed. Thems the facts. All else is assertion.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Yes, that's what he's saying. He'll assert it until it appears to be true just from the constant assertion of it too.

Good point. Too late for that. The U.S. should have refrained from considering massive civilian caualities acceptable "collateral damage." Liberators do not threaten your children with torture and rape, or bomb apartment buildings and kill dozens of women and children on the off chance that a few enemies might be there. We did that in Vietnam. Didn't work. It's hard to win the hearts and minds when you blow up the bodies. Yes. Both the Dresden fire storm and Hiroshima were unnecessary bloody revenge. No, kill kill kill is really pretty simple. Hasn't worked yet. What does Christ say about it, Ian?How many times has Israel tried the Hammer of God Solution? Ms. Rice sees "the birth pangs of a new Middle East" among th cluster bombs strafing fleeing Lebanese civilians; Kissinger made similar remarks in 1982--the birthing then was of Hezbollah. What do you think is being born amidst the rubble now--surrender? Not bloody likely.

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He didn't address nations or unbelievers except to tell them to believe. How many many many times has Israel given into pressure to give up land for "peace" even knowing that their enemy hasn't an honest bone in their body when it comes to promises of peace, and knowing that they are going to be put at a disadvantage in this process once again? If the world would stop restraining Israel, then their methods probably WOULD bring about a surrender. But with all the world holding the hands of the terrorists (who laugh behind their backs) and indignantly condemning Israel for its self-protective operations, they keep the situation at a boil. Shut up and stand back, let Israel defeat them soundly, and THEN you'll see them HAVE to come to a settlement, probably even a Palestinian state, and permanent protected borders for Israel for a change.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

I listened to it as soon as you posted it.An interesting but not altogether surprising piece of information, but insufficient by itself to convince me the hit on the UN post wasn't deliberate.The most telling thing is - as far as I have heard to date - that the final destruction of the UN post and the death of the four unarmed observers was as a result of a laser guided bomb from an Israeli aircraft.That's unlikely to be a mistake or an accident or collateral damage.There was a piece on BBC News 24 last night where they showed pictures of the UN observation posts in that area along with an interview with a guy who'd been a UN observer there a few years back.The posts are painted white, with the letters UN painted on them in 6 foot high letters and are sited as much as possible in clear areas (or the areas around them are cleared - not sure which) - they stick out like a sore thumb.From CBC: Four direct artillery hits on the base, no Hezbollah firing in the immediate vicinity at the time and then an airstrike to destroy the base.It still doesn't sound like an accident or mistake to me.I also don't hold out much hope of an investigation by the perpetrators throwing much light on what really happened.

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Oops! Wrong Planet

Described as you say, no, it doesn't sound like an accident. But appearances are often deceiving and there is too much rush to judgment against Israel. It makes NO sense for Israel to attack a UN post intentionally, just none whatever, so I expect some blunder to explain it in the end. But yes, more facts are needed. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.