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Author Topic:   Fresh Problem with the Ark
mark24
Member (Idle past 5224 days)
Posts: 3857
From: UK
Joined: 12-01-2001


Message 132 of 328 (118667)
06-25-2004 2:27 PM
Reply to: Message 131 by simple
06-25-2004 2:17 PM


Re: how about it?
arkathon,
Makes you wonder why god bothered with a flood at all, doesn't it? I mean, he could achieve his ends without even clicking his fingers, why go to all that bother, not to mention causing all that suffering.
Mark

This message is a reply to:
 Message 131 by simple, posted 06-25-2004 2:17 PM simple has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 134 by simple, posted 06-25-2004 2:31 PM mark24 has replied

mark24
Member (Idle past 5224 days)
Posts: 3857
From: UK
Joined: 12-01-2001


Message 135 of 328 (118673)
06-25-2004 2:38 PM
Reply to: Message 134 by simple
06-25-2004 2:31 PM


Re: how about it?
arkathon,
We have our part to play, you know! After all, who built the ark? Who had the babies to populate the earth? (dirty job but someone's gotta do it)
Why was there a flood in the first place? Why couldn't he just click his fingers & make it OK? No need for an ark at all.
Just seems a roundabout way to get from a to b for an omnipotent being.
Mark

There are 10 kinds of people in this world; those that understand binary, & those that don't

This message is a reply to:
 Message 134 by simple, posted 06-25-2004 2:31 PM simple has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 137 by simple, posted 06-25-2004 3:10 PM mark24 has replied
 Message 147 by pink sasquatch, posted 06-25-2004 6:12 PM mark24 has replied

mark24
Member (Idle past 5224 days)
Posts: 3857
From: UK
Joined: 12-01-2001


Message 171 of 328 (118992)
06-26-2004 9:41 AM
Reply to: Message 137 by simple
06-25-2004 3:10 PM


Re: how about it?
arkathon,
Perhaps He should just have taken away free will, and made the wicked obey?
What's so bad about that? Taking away the free will to do evil. It's what law enforcement & security implementation attempts to do, anyway. What's so bad about a world like today with the sole exception that no one can commit an evil act? It's the ultimate security measure that allows you to exercise free will in every other way. It sounds like a much nicer place to live.
That's how I'd do it, & I wouldn't have to drown everyone at a later date, either. But then even if I did have to eliminate evil (like it worked), being omnipotent, I wouldn't be such a bastard as to kill everything, I'd correct my mistakes with a click of my fingers.
Mark
This message has been edited by mark24, 06-26-2004 08:48 AM

There are 10 kinds of people in this world; those that understand binary, & those that don't

This message is a reply to:
 Message 137 by simple, posted 06-25-2004 3:10 PM simple has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 177 by simple, posted 06-26-2004 11:25 PM mark24 has replied

mark24
Member (Idle past 5224 days)
Posts: 3857
From: UK
Joined: 12-01-2001


Message 172 of 328 (118993)
06-26-2004 9:42 AM
Reply to: Message 147 by pink sasquatch
06-25-2004 6:12 PM


Re: how about it?
pink sasquatch,
torture = love? not my God...
Nor mine.
Mark

This message is a reply to:
 Message 147 by pink sasquatch, posted 06-25-2004 6:12 PM pink sasquatch has not replied

mark24
Member (Idle past 5224 days)
Posts: 3857
From: UK
Joined: 12-01-2001


Message 188 of 328 (119185)
06-27-2004 5:46 AM
Reply to: Message 177 by simple
06-26-2004 11:25 PM


Re: free will
arkathon,
What's so bad about taking away free will? I think it is important to God. He doesn't want robots, He wants people to chose to love Him. We even have the real choice not to.
If that's your definition of free will, then you are basically saying god let's you make a choice based on faith alone, & viciously eliminates the majority decision he doesn't like.
I guess this is what us non-christians have such a hard time reconciling. On one hand you are telling us god is all good & wonderful, on the other, god drowns you/throws you into fire & brimstone for eternity because you didn't make the right decision. Of course, the only way you can know the right decision is to have logically valid solid evidence. But god deliberately denies us this facility, you have to make a decision based on faith. As such, any evidentially unsupported decision is as good as any other, which makes the choice a random stick the pin in the picture game, & hope you get the right god.
God punishes people for not making the right choice without really allowing them the means for doing so. It just doesn't jive with any meaning of the terms, "all loving", "good", that any of the rest of us would understand. I suppose Stalin, Genghis, & Herr Hitler would fit the definion of "fun loving pussy cat", in that case.
You cannot be considered loving & good when you act so punitively. If god exists & is omnipotent then "loving" alternatives exist to a violent death & an eternity in hell.
Did it occur to you that the majority of people aren't, & have never been christians? What's so different now compared to then? I'd maker your next book purchase a boat building one.
We chose in the Garden to listen to the lies of the serpent saying God was not telling the truth.
No, WE didn't. A maximum of TWO people did. According to this logic god should have flooded the garden of eden pretty much instantly.
Thing is, the only real choice that counts is Him or the other guy. All the evil results from the wrong choice.
But it's not a dichotomy. There is the choice to reject gods, accept others, or to accept that without evidence there is no sufficient method of making a decision, either way.
And why are peple who allegedly made the right choice just as capable of evil? Seems to me that accepting JC & god is no guarantee of not committing evil.
So what gives?
Doesn't matter if you snipped some piece of perceived evil away, the wicked heart of sinful God rejecting man has plenty more.
I never suggested I would eliminate evil. I suggested that god should do it, why can't he snip all of the evil out? I mean, just what kick does god get out of creating people who refuse to accept him without evidence, & then drown & fry them for the application of perfectly good logic?
Sounds like a set up.
Mark

There are 10 kinds of people in this world; those that understand binary, & those that don't

This message is a reply to:
 Message 177 by simple, posted 06-26-2004 11:25 PM simple has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 189 by RAZD, posted 06-27-2004 6:45 AM mark24 has not replied

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