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Author Topic:   Is It Bigoted To Have A Supported Opinion?
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9516
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.1


(1)
Message 19 of 175 (698104)
05-03-2013 4:46 AM


If you have opinions that are out of step with society's mores you stand the risk of being called a bigot. It's difficult to be counter-cultural and not be regarded as either a bigot or insane. (And, to be fair, both or either state is often the case.)
I've been watching the change in peoples' attitudes to immigration in the UK for some time. Around 10 years ago multiculturalism was the belief system we were supposed to have - people who disagreed were called racists and bigots. (And many of them actually were.) Any discussion was closed down very quickly by that kind of intervention.
Then a combination of high immigration, unemployment and a declining economy caused a shift towards protectionism and people began to question the sense of an open door immigration policy.
Gradually, the climate changed until today it's perfectly acceptable to discuss immigration policy openly and indeed, only today the political climate has changed so much that a new party UKIP (UK Independence Party) whose main, and maybe only, policy is to get us out of Europe and stop immigration, has made sweeping gains in local elections.
Where the charge of bigot is used to close down a conversation or debate, it's an assault on a right to hold an unpopular opinion and it's intellectually dishonest to use it in argument - generally people are only expressing their opinion of what they like and dislike. I think that's a perfectly fair thing to be able to say, with being verbally assaulted.
Having said all that, Phat is obviously wrong headed in his opinion, but has a perfect right to give it without being accused of bigotry off-hand - it's too strong a word to be chucked around like that.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

Replies to this message:
 Message 21 by AZPaul3, posted 05-03-2013 7:34 AM Tangle has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9516
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 43 of 175 (698153)
05-03-2013 11:36 AM
Reply to: Message 29 by Percy
05-03-2013 10:43 AM


Percy writes:
So obviously my position on whether our moral judgments should affect which rights we confer or withhold is inconsistent, varying according to which moral judgment is under consideration.
And possibly also with the era that you are living in?
Homosexuality was crime in the UK until as recently as 1967. Sodomy was punishable in some US states by up to 10 years imprisonment in 1963.
I doubt Phat's views would have generally be regarded as bigoted in, say, the 1950s.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

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 Message 29 by Percy, posted 05-03-2013 10:43 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 46 by dronestar, posted 05-03-2013 11:46 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9516
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 48 of 175 (698179)
05-03-2013 3:49 PM
Reply to: Message 46 by dronestar
05-03-2013 11:46 AM


dronestar writes:
Couldn't we extrapolate that rationale to the era of the bronze age? For example . . .
"I doubt the bible's views about genocide, infanticide, slavery, and sexism would have generally been regarded as immoral in, say, the first and second century."
If true, wouldn't that say that god's inspiration for the bible was really half assed?
Er, yes, exactly. It's obviously a moral tale for its own time. Our ideas about morality change and develop over time. Phat's views are simply out of time.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

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 Message 46 by dronestar, posted 05-03-2013 11:46 AM dronestar has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 52 by Phat, posted 05-06-2013 10:17 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9516
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.1


(1)
Message 55 of 175 (698387)
05-06-2013 12:06 PM
Reply to: Message 52 by Phat
05-06-2013 10:17 AM


Re: Communion
Phat writes:
Did it ever occur to you that God may have created some of us with attraction for our own gender not to encourage procreation, nor sexual pleasure but, rather, for some deeper emotional bonding? In other words, ask yourself what the possible purposes of attraction really are.
This is too weird for me - you're going to have to explain wha you think it means.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by Phat, posted 05-06-2013 10:17 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

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 Message 56 by dronestar, posted 05-06-2013 12:27 PM Tangle has not replied

  
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