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Author
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Topic: What we must accept if we accept evolution Part 2
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: robinrohan once again makes unsupported assertions.
Logically, you are forced to. Evolution is cruel, bloody, murderous. Unsuported assertion. Also way OT. But start a thread on it and I'll be glad to discuss it.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Message 131 of 301 (282946)
01-31-2006 5:51 PM
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Reply to: Message 128 by Faith
01-31-2006 5:37 PM
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Re: Traditional Christianity is...?
So far you have only presented a collection of unfounded unsupported assertions. Did you say:
Faith writes: THEREFORE the Biblical God as TRADITIONAL CHRISTIANITY worships Him, is incompatible with evolution.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 128 by Faith, posted 01-31-2006 5:37 PM | | Faith has not replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Message 135 of 301 (282950)
01-31-2006 5:55 PM
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Reply to: Message 132 by PaulK
01-31-2006 5:52 PM
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Re: robinrohan once again makes unsupported assertions.
Yup, refuted on all counts.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 132 by PaulK, posted 01-31-2006 5:52 PM | | PaulK has not replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Message 148 of 301 (282995)
01-31-2006 9:01 PM
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Reply to: Message 147 by iano
01-31-2006 8:45 PM
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Really
iano writes: There's a rule somewhere about attacking the argument not the person. Guess what???????? In the section your quoted:
quote:
I could go on forever, but frankly I don't see the point. In the latter half of this thread you have done nothing to argue your point against people who contradict your view, resorting instead to glib remarks and spamming you opinion relentlessly without any refutation or new material.
the specific subject is the content of the posts and the general lack of pertinent content.
One might pose the biblical argument which indicates that God made the Earth without any disease or death or pain or suffering. You might if you totally ignore what's written in the Bible.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 147 by iano, posted 01-31-2006 8:45 PM | | iano has not replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: robinrohan once again makes unsupported assertions.
robinrohan writes: You don't seem to know what the topic is, Jar. Let me explain it to you. The topic (part of it) is as follows: I am contending that if you believe in evolution, you cannot believe in God. Yes robin, I fully understand that is your assertion... and it has been refuted! You say it is impossible to believe, I say look, here are people that do believe. That refutes your assertion. There is no way around it unless you show the same willfull ignorance as the YECs.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Message 185 of 301 (283132)
02-01-2006 11:03 AM
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Reply to: Message 174 by Faith
02-01-2006 8:05 AM
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Re: Is the concept of a "Fall" not a viable excuse?
That has been traditional Christianity, the religion of the West, until the last 150 years or so, when Liberal Christianity came along, which is what those 10000 on jar's list represent -- including Deism, which is basically an earlier form of Liberal Christianity. It is not a matter of liberal Christianity Faith, it is a matter of FACT. It is not possible to believe a literal Genesis unless you deny GOD's creation.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 174 by Faith, posted 02-01-2006 8:05 AM | | Faith has not replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: robinrohan once again makes unsupported assertions.
Robin Is this an accurate quote of what you said?
robinrohan writes: You don't seem to know what the topic is, Jar. Let me explain it to you. The topic (part of it) is as follows: I am contending that if you believe in evolution, you cannot believe in God.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: robinrohan once again makes unsupported assertions.
Is it what you said? That is a yes or no question. But I will also try refute your assertion that it is logigically impossible to believe in GOD, and also accept the TOE. It's a subject that I've addressed here at EvC numerous times but repetition is often good. First, any belief in a supernatural being is basically an irrational, unprovable action. It is an act of Faith and not Science. Would you agree with that?
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Message 191 of 301 (283154)
02-01-2006 11:46 AM
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Reply to: Message 190 by Modulous
02-01-2006 11:37 AM
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Re: quote mining
In my reply to robin I am trying to address his additional concerns.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 190 by Modulous, posted 02-01-2006 11:37 AM | | Modulous has not replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: robinrohan once again makes unsupported assertions.
I thought people believed in God because they thought they had a good reason to do so. I imagine that do think they have a good reason for their belief. What does that have to do with what I asked?
jar writes: First, any belief in a supernatural being is basically an irrational, unprovable action. It is an act of Faith and not Science. Would you agree with that?
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: robinrohan once again makes unsupported assertions.
"Faith" is not a good reason. Why?
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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on Belief
Belief is completely a matter of Faith. There is no hard evidence as can be found in any of the sciences, cannot be. Afterall, GOD is something which cannot be tested, observed, replicated or subjected to peer review. It really is that one day, someone does say that they believe in GOD. They may have various reasons; in my case I look at the Universe, the fact that the rules seem to be consistent across everything we've observed, the absolute wonder of Evolution and the system that lead to the magnificant variety and malleability of the life we see, lead me to my belief in GOD, but it is simply a matter of Faith, not something I can prove.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 200 by robinrohan, posted 02-01-2006 7:44 PM | | robinrohan has not replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Message 204 of 301 (283295)
02-01-2006 8:42 PM
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Reply to: Message 203 by Faith
02-01-2006 8:31 PM
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Re: Not at all irrational.
It is irrational because it is not based on reality, but rather what I, the individual believe. GOD, if GOD exists, exists whether or not I believe GOD exists. And if GOD does not exist, GOD does not exist whether or not I believe GOD exists. But my belief is simply that, a belief. There is nothing that can be used to support that belief. What I observe regarding the rules could equally be causeless, simply how things are. I do not think that's the case, but it is equally persuasive; an irrational belief, Faith.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 203 by Faith, posted 02-01-2006 8:31 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 208 by Faith, posted 02-02-2006 10:49 AM | | jar has replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Message 209 of 301 (283394)
02-02-2006 11:07 AM
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Reply to: Message 205 by iano
02-02-2006 6:29 AM
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Re: on Belief
Regardless of whether it is a mattr of deduction or what you call revelation, it is still all internal. While you very likely believe that there was a revelation from God, you cannot know that. You can believe it, believe it very strongly, but there can be no evidence of that external impartation. There is no such thing as belief from without unless you can provided some way that it can be tested and independently verified.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 205 by iano, posted 02-02-2006 6:29 AM | | iano has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 231 by iano, posted 02-02-2006 7:03 PM | | jar has replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Message 210 of 301 (283402)
02-02-2006 11:26 AM
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Reply to: Message 208 by Faith
02-02-2006 10:49 AM
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Defending belief?
All this means is that you have given up trying to defend your belief. I think that is a very important point. I do not believe that it's necessary to defend my belief. Nor, IMHO, should any Christian feel such a need. Christianity is not something that should need to be defended, but rather shared. Someone who is really a Christian has nothing to defend. It's a religion, a belief that revolves around trying to do the best that you can. What possible need is there to defend trying to do what's right, for trying to treat others as you wish they treated you?
To the extent you are right, that there are many who do have a groundless belief, then that belief will not sustain them when it comes to a test. If "they" shackled you in a dark place with sewage up to your waist and rising, and rats nibbling at your exposed flesh, would you deny Christ to be set free? How many who have this "irrational belief" do you think would? Down through the ages, many have shown such "irrational belief". The people at Jonestown, the Branch Davidians, those in Heaven's Gate, the Manson Family. It's also those who think in terms of absolutes that generally inflict such punishments on others. IMHO, if GOD exists, he would simply laugh at anyone who suffered such a fate and did not simply deny God. Any God that would want critters to suffer like that for his name sake is not a real GOD but only some little crack selling Bling-bling Pimp Daddy, worried that somebody got in his face and dissed him. That would not be a GOD, or God or even god.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 208 by Faith, posted 02-02-2006 10:49 AM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 212 by Faith, posted 02-02-2006 11:46 AM | | jar has replied |
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