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Author Topic:   The Results are in...There is a God! - What now?
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 73 of 159 (371991)
12-24-2006 11:47 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by U can call me Cookie
04-12-2006 9:24 AM


There are many things that have been left unadressed here. You say that this god would be in control, and that it/he/she would be benevolent. However, would you have proof that this god MUST be in control? An entity with supreme power still reserves the right to refuse involvement in the world. And why would that detract from said entity's benevolence?
Would there be any consequences from not worshipping this god? Perhaps it is not the Christian god; perhaps (being so careless to the suffering of the world) she/he/it also doesn't give a damn whether or not we worship him/it/she. And, maybe he/she/it does care, but perhaps has no methods in place for punishing those who refuse worshipping, and no rewards set in place for those who do worship.
Really, one would need far more information before making any decision about what to do with the discovery of a supreme deity.
Do you have it?
J0N

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by U can call me Cookie, posted 04-12-2006 9:24 AM U can call me Cookie has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 95 by Archer Opteryx, posted 12-25-2006 1:59 PM Jon has not replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 78 of 159 (372057)
12-24-2006 5:23 PM
Reply to: Message 74 by ringo
12-24-2006 12:13 PM


Re: Worship God?
God gives us free will because He wants us to choose Him freely and of our own faith, else we're just mindless drones.
Sure He sets limits on just how freely we can use our will, but that is nothing more than any government does. He gives us the choice because He realizes that a forced confession is no good. He needs to know that we really DO love Him.
I mean, look at the people in the world who do not accept God into their lives. If they were simply forced to follow Him anyway, imagine all the "false" souls that would make it into Heaven. Free will is just another test... remember, Job?
He gives us a choice. Choose the left path, or the right path. But, He says, be warned that the left path is filled with sorrow and tragedy and ends with your own eternal suffering. Really, He gives us all the information that's needed to follow Him, and being concious beings, it is up to us to follow it .
J0N

This message is a reply to:
 Message 74 by ringo, posted 12-24-2006 12:13 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 84 by ringo, posted 12-25-2006 1:10 AM Jon has not replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 79 of 159 (372058)
12-24-2006 5:31 PM
Reply to: Message 77 by iceage
12-24-2006 2:02 PM


Re: Worship God?
Because your vantage point allows you greater knowledge and control of the situation you are the responsible entity - not the fish.
But God gave us all the rules and information necessary to keep our asses in the tank. If we still decided to jump out, that's our problem!
Imagine you buy a bookcase in a box. It has instructions for assembly. Sure, the manufacturer has greater knowledge of the precise methods involved, and how they made the wood, etc. But to get to the finished product, you just have to assemble it and don't need that extra know-how. There is a book, in the box (not to put on the shelf), but to read through so that you can properly assemble the book case. Now, if you choose not to follow the instructions, and end up with a hole in the back and 45 shelves, whose fault is that?
God is the manufacturer; our lives are the bookcase. The finished product is the eternal life we can have in Heaven with God. Now, all we need is the instruction book... wait, we already have it: The Bible. If we screw it up, it's our own fault, and not God's.
J0N

This message is a reply to:
 Message 77 by iceage, posted 12-24-2006 2:02 PM iceage has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 80 by fallacycop, posted 12-24-2006 5:44 PM Jon has replied
 Message 83 by Vacate, posted 12-24-2006 10:57 PM Jon has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 88 of 159 (372145)
12-25-2006 3:48 AM
Reply to: Message 80 by fallacycop
12-24-2006 5:44 PM


Re: Worship God?
(Don`t even say the Bible cause that cannot possibly be it)
I already DID say that. And tell me, why cannot that possibly be it?
J0N

This message is a reply to:
 Message 80 by fallacycop, posted 12-24-2006 5:44 PM fallacycop has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 92 by Rob, posted 12-25-2006 12:04 PM Jon has not replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 89 of 159 (372146)
12-25-2006 4:05 AM
Reply to: Message 83 by Vacate
12-24-2006 10:57 PM


Re: Worship God?
The Bible teaches us that we can reach God through following the instructions that it gives. Instruction booklets promise the same thing: a completed product after following their instructions.
Then imagine that the instructions were not written by the inventor. The inventor refuses to update the instructions that he may or may not have written. All the parts are different and its not completely clear what you are trying to build. You thought it was a bookcase, but it more appears to be some twisted form of chess.
What evidence do you have for ANYTHING you've just said? Where did you gain the information that says you WON'T go to Heaven if you follow God's will as it is written in the Bible?
Tell me, when was the last time you tried to make it into Heaven by following what was written in the Bible? If you did, did you get there or not? The bookcase analogy is different on only one level: you can experience and learn from puting the bookcase together, whereas with the will of God, you only have one chance.
What if you spent $3.4 million on that bookcase? What if it were the LAST one in the store? What if it were so extremely important, you could not live without? Would you take the chance of not following the instructions. Remember, you don't KNOW the instructions are bad, and they claim to be good, so what do you do?
The Bible is most-likely the best instruction book we have, and we have no reason to believe it isn't. God is real, He created us, and He is supremely powerful. Now, if you want to go be with God when you die, then use His instruction booklet, otherwise, find a different thread .
J0N

This message is a reply to:
 Message 83 by Vacate, posted 12-24-2006 10:57 PM Vacate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 90 by RickJB, posted 12-25-2006 6:57 AM Jon has replied
 Message 93 by Rob, posted 12-25-2006 12:11 PM Jon has not replied
 Message 124 by Vacate, posted 12-28-2006 12:41 AM Jon has not replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 91 of 159 (372157)
12-25-2006 9:05 AM
Reply to: Message 90 by RickJB
12-25-2006 6:57 AM


Re: Worship God?
Jon writes:
The Bible is most likely the best instruction book we have...
Oh really? I'm pretty sure people of other faiths will have a differing opinion on this.....
It's up to them. If they want to assemble their bookcase using fooseball table instructions, they are free to do so. Just don't let them go crying about it when they can't figure out where to put the ball.
It's a personal choice, really. If someone else wants to argue for a different instruction book, they can. But in the end, only the manufacturer can tell us which booklet was supposed to come with the set .
J0N

This message is a reply to:
 Message 90 by RickJB, posted 12-25-2006 6:57 AM RickJB has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 94 by Archer Opteryx, posted 12-25-2006 1:53 PM Jon has not replied
 Message 99 by RickJB, posted 12-25-2006 3:10 PM Jon has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 100 of 159 (372242)
12-26-2006 12:41 AM
Reply to: Message 99 by RickJB
12-25-2006 3:10 PM


Re: Worship God?
Um... I'm agnostic/atheist. But you cannot call the God false, because the entire topic of this thread is that He is real.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 99 by RickJB, posted 12-25-2006 3:10 PM RickJB has not replied

  
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