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Author Topic:   Evolution or Creation
Archer Opteryx
Member (Idle past 3626 days)
Posts: 1811
From: East Asia
Joined: 08-16-2006


Message 209 of 301 (396840)
04-22-2007 1:19 PM
Reply to: Message 204 by dwise1
04-22-2007 4:02 AM


Re: Biologist
Thanks for sharing that, dwise1. Wow.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 204 by dwise1, posted 04-22-2007 4:02 AM dwise1 has not replied

Archer Opteryx
Member (Idle past 3626 days)
Posts: 1811
From: East Asia
Joined: 08-16-2006


Message 210 of 301 (396844)
04-22-2007 2:06 PM
Reply to: Message 68 by ICANT
04-18-2007 6:09 PM


Re: Granny & Gillespie
ICANT:
So you eat, drink and be merry for one day you will die, then what?
The judgment.
Well, you can always not eat, not drink and be miserable. Then you die sooner. To each his own.
That covers life choices. Now let's look at that end game.
You talk about death and judgement as if they were equal certainties. They are not.
Death is inevitable. Judgement is a rumour.
Isn't it interesting that no one who talks about an afterlife lives in one? Everyone who talks about the afterlife does so in this life. Some of them can really chatter on about it. But the instant they pass over to the other side, the moment they would finally get some first-hand experience to relate, they have nothing more to say.
You've noticed this, of course.
One thing human beings do when faced with something we can't control is we try to bargain. We say things like 'Why couldn't it have been me instead of that person?' or 'Why couldn't it have been that person instead of me?' We ask why something happens on this day of all days and not some other, why this fate and not some other. We talk as if a menu existed somewhere and we were supposed to get a choice.
Everyone does this at first. It's an impulse. We talk as if we had leverage. It takes time for the reality to settle in. Sometimes there are no deals to make. Things happen.
You know all about this impulse. You like making bargains. Every turn this thread shows you talking of barter and trade.
You want to make a deal. But not with us.
You talk constantly of approaching death. You weigh the benefits, calculate the odds, choose your alignments. You talk of trading your announced loyalties for wealth or genius or science or atheism.
You talk as if you had leverage. You want to deal.
Your testimonies on this thread look like efforts to make one last good impression on that unseen critic out there in the hall (is anyone watching?). You're giving him the show you've been told he wants. You play the prophet declaring the gospel 'unto' us, you warn us of impending judgement. You declare your lifelong loyalty to the critic. You mention the worldly goods you never got (is the critic listening?)--then say it doesn't matter, you are happy just to have been a loyal team player all along. That seven-year-old boy wants to score a few more points with the drama teacher before the school play ends.
At the same time, he has trouble staying in character. Even as he plays the loyalist, he candidly admits he could 'just as easily' believe something else. He admits his beliefs are 'chosen'--picked up and put on like a costume. Even as the show goes on, he conducts cost-benefit analyses of continuing to play in it.
If the critic in the balcony exists as you imagine him, he might prefer a performance with more feeling.
____
Edited by Archer Opterix, : typo repair.
Edited by Archer Opterix, : clarity.
Edited by Archer Opterix, : brev.

Archer
All species are transitional.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 68 by ICANT, posted 04-18-2007 6:09 PM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 217 by ICANT, posted 04-24-2007 2:41 AM Archer Opteryx has replied

Archer Opteryx
Member (Idle past 3626 days)
Posts: 1811
From: East Asia
Joined: 08-16-2006


Message 252 of 301 (397229)
04-25-2007 2:54 AM
Reply to: Message 217 by ICANT
04-24-2007 2:41 AM


Willed Belief, or, Let's Make a Deal!
I Cant:
Now if I was to tell you that in l965 science said I was dead for 3 hours and 20 minutes, and in that time I saw the City The New Jerusalem and the river of life that flows from the throne of God you would say, I was crazy, went off the deep end, was deluded or many other things you could think of. So I won't tell you that.
Too bad then. Until you tell me, you don't know what I would say.
You can only nurture your 'chosen belief' about what what I would say. That is a conjecture you have chosen not to test against reality.
You choose to believe man and man's wisdom.
I choose nothing of the kind.
Belief is an automatic, honest response that arises in me when something strikes me as credible. It is a response far less likely to arise in me, I notice, when a proposition seems incredible or insufficiently demonstrated.
Can't help it. Just happens that way. It's how belief works.
Your beliefs work the same way. Your real beliefs, I mean.
One cannot choose to believe. One is convinced or one isn't. Beliefs are those things you feel you know, really know, even when you are alone.
One can choose alignments, though. One can choose manifestos and creeds, which can then be regurgitated when one wants to make a ritual declaration of loyalty...
Now my testimony: I believe God.
I believe God...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe Jesus...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I believe...
I choose to believe all these things...
I choose to believe God.
Lets see I have a beautiful waterfront home, a 2007 Entourage van, a 2007 Nissan pickup, and a farm. They are all paid for all I have to pay is the taxes each year to the government to keep them.
. . . .
My God has supplied all these things.
Atheism would have given me the following:
DrJones told me...
Doddy told me...
Stile said...
Ringo said...
Would you like to add anything?
No. But God would.
He says to tell you that if you make three more testimonies like the one above, he'll throw in a free GPS with that 2007 Nissan pickup.
Do you choose to believe God, or not?
____
Edited by Archer Opterix, : html.
Edited by Archer Opterix, : ongoing quest for literary perfection.

Archer
All species are transitional.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 217 by ICANT, posted 04-24-2007 2:41 AM ICANT has not replied

Archer Opteryx
Member (Idle past 3626 days)
Posts: 1811
From: East Asia
Joined: 08-16-2006


Message 282 of 301 (397494)
04-26-2007 9:21 AM
Reply to: Message 271 by ICANT
04-25-2007 11:31 AM


Re: prayer wheeling & dealing
I would be very careful about calling God the Holy Spirit a liar, He might exist and hear whoever did.
A quintessential I Cant statement.
Not 'I'd be careful because I might be saying something unjust.' Only 'I'd be careful because someone who can hurt me might get mad.'
Everything's a contract. A deal. Say only nice things about Mr Deity and Mr Deity doesn't beat anyone up.
___
Edited by Archer Opterix, : punctuation.
Edited by Archer Opterix, : brev.

Archer
All species are transitional.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 271 by ICANT, posted 04-25-2007 11:31 AM ICANT has not replied

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