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Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
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Author | Topic: Continuation of Flood Discussion | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
edge Member (Idle past 1735 days) Posts: 4696 From: Colorado, USA Joined:
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I already answered everything you are so ridiculously misrepresenting or posing again in that post.
I may have seen some answers, but nothing to back them up.
Take it or leave it.
There isn't much to take away. It appears that you really don't know much about what your flood left behind. I remember one YEC who told me that the flood was so devastating the it destroyed all evidence of its passing. That was, of course, very convenient for his argument.
You'll leave it of course and go on misrepresenting it. Tired of trying to argue in good faith. See ya later.
Arguing from the standpoint of not knowing much is always more frustrating than from knowing something about the subject material. So take your time. I'm curious however, as to your evidence that the Appalachians are the same age as the Rockies. If you get a chance, perhaps you could let us know. Edited by edge, : No reason given.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
So you have lake sediments in the Claron. After the Flood. What IS your problem?
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
The evidence is that the timing fits the Flood timing and continental drift fits the Flood timing and continental drift is part of the tectonic activity that occurred after the Flood and raised the mountains and all that. There you go.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Then it leached upward, how about that.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Okay, assuming you use the term 'fact' loosely in this question, I would set about attempting to find evidence for this flood and then pursue some kind of mechanism, timing, etc. You will notice that this has not been the strategy of YEC scientists. They go about doing the equivalent of proving that internal combustion doesn't work after they've removed the wiring from the engine. There is blatant in-your-face evidence for the Flood in the Geologic Column and its bazillions of fossils. That is STUPENDOUS evidence for the Flood, which can only be klutzily explained away by OE fairytales about nonexistent time periods. Fossils are NOT being made at any rate comparable, and today's sedimentary rate which you brag about knowing is NOT the rate of the Flood deposition. So we don't need to find evidence, we have tons of it. It's just been co-opted by anti-Flood people. The creation scientists are also exploring questions about mechanism, but if there was no rain until the forty days and nights of rain and you don't know what the "fountains of the deep" are, you tell us how you would go about investigating these things. It's not that they aren't doing it you know.
Again, believing in it, knowing it happened. Denying it happened is not an option. We use the facts and evidence we have. You think it's not enough, too bad, it's what we have.
In that case, I would be searching for evidence of the flood for a verrrrry long time. This provides a whole new understanding of the term 'quixotic'. No, you'd be doing what we're doing. Abd of course you don't believe in God so your opinion is worthless. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
They're really not, though, are they? All they're doing is speculating what coulda/woulda/shoulda/mighta happened, to reverse-engineer a Flood from evidence that doesn't support a Flood. The creation scientists are also exploring questions about mechanism.... And you're telling us that those speculations can not be tested, so there's really no "exploration" involved, is there? You're drawing a map of what could/would/should/might be there and at the same time you're telling us that there's no way to go there to confirm your map.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2135 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: |
The evidence is that the timing fits the Flood timing and continental drift fits the Flood timing Evidence? You have none. All you have is belief and you're just making up whatever feels good to fit within that belief. Evidence is the last thing you either need or want.Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein How can I possibly put a new idea into your heads, if I do not first remove your delusions?--Robert A. Heinlein It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" does not include the American culture. That is what it is against.
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
There is blatant in-your-face evidence for the Flood in the Geologic Column and its bazillions of fossils. As has been pointed out any number of times. That evidence is completely consistent with an ancient earth and no flood. And when viewed in detail, the arrangement of fossils requires Creation proponents to put forth inane explanations that do not work. That problem alone is enough to rule out the flood as a cause of the geologic column. Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
NoNukes writes:
I recall somebody suggesting that birds are higher in the geological column than dinosaurs because they might have been riding on dinosaurs. ... the arrangement of fossils requires Creation proponents to put forth inane explanations that do not work.Henny Youngman must be spinning in his grave.
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
I recall somebody suggesting that birds are higher in the geological column than dinosaurs because they might have been riding on dinosaurs. It's as sensible as any other thing they've come up with;
Henny Youngman There are a few clips of HY on youtube. I took the opportunity to watch a couple. Thanks Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass
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edge Member (Idle past 1735 days) Posts: 4696 From: Colorado, USA Joined:
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There is blatant in-your-face evidence for the Flood in the Geologic Column and its bazillions of fossils. That is STUPENDOUS evidence for the Flood, which can only be klutzily explained away by OE fairytales about nonexistent time periods.
Poison the well much? I see that we have your opinion regarding evolution, but do you have any actual evidence for your own scenario. This is exactly what I suggested earlier when I said that YECs don't look for supporting evidence, they can only tilt at windmills. Your post itself is supporting evidence of that.
Fossils are NOT being made at any rate comparable, and today's sedimentary rate which you brag about knowing is NOT the rate of the Flood deposition. So we don't need to find evidence, we have tons of it. It's just been co-opted by anti-Flood people.
Sure, if you assume they were deposited in 4ky years. However, can you imagine what it would have been like if all of those bazillions of organisms were actually alive just before the fludde?
The creation scientists are also exploring questions about mechanism, but if there was no rain until the forty days and nights of rain and you don't know what the "fountains of the deep" are, you tell us how you would go about investigating these things. It's not that they aren't doing it you know.
Of course I don't know what 'fountains of the deep are'. No one has ever seen one or even described one, AKAIK. Just another example of YEC science not doing its job.
No, you'd be doing what we're doing.
Well, I admit that you don't have much choice. However, I seriously doubt I'd do anything the YEC way.
Abd of course you don't believe in God so your opinion is worthless.
Why should I?
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edge Member (Idle past 1735 days) Posts: 4696 From: Colorado, USA Joined: |
Then it leached upward, how about that.
Good. Now you need a place to deposit the salt.
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edge Member (Idle past 1735 days) Posts: 4696 From: Colorado, USA Joined:
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The evidence is that the timing fits the Flood timing and continental drift fits the Flood timing and continental drift is part of the tectonic activity that occurred after the Flood and raised the mountains and all that. There you go.
That's just a story. Until you have evidence to support it, you really have nothing but a sleeping aid. For instance, we know that there was emergent land elsewhere during the period of deposition of the GC-GS stratigraphic sequences. Oh wait! That's not part of your 'same data' package. You dismissed that weeks ago.
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edge Member (Idle past 1735 days) Posts: 4696 From: Colorado, USA Joined: |
So you have lake sediments in the Claron. After the Flood. What IS your problem?
My problem is your inconsistency. You said that all of the sediments were deposited by the fludde and then the uplift and faulting occurred. But clearly. the Claron is post fludde because, as you stated, lakes and streams came after the fludde. I'm just trying to understand your reasoning.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
What wasn't clear to me is that you are apparently talking about the composition of the Claron layer itself as "lacustrine." At least I hope this clears it up. I just kept reading lakes and rivers on the surface which of course occurred after the Flood. So you want to know how lake type sediments got deposited BY the Flood? And my answer to that is Why not? The Flood would have deposited whatever was available to be deposited. OK? You aren't identifying what you mean by lake type sediments, is there any reason the Flood couldn't have deposited them?
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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