A question for Athiests/Evolutionists. (re: How can one not belive in something greater than himself? et all)

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God allowed evil to be created by the devil. I do not find him resposible.

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No I don't find the devil responsible either- it's clear from what you have said that God could stop this when he wants. He must get some form of sick kick from allowing the devil to do this.I mean if you had a dog and you allowed it to bit people, who would be responsible - the dog? or the owner?

Yes. Paul who was saul says that death was like a king who reigned because we chose sin.And you are correct, we should blame the attacker - as his actions are still essentially evil.I find it amusing that people would say evil doesn't exist, and describe killing, say - a young child - as something else. Yet blame God for OT killings. Lol. This is the problem with unbelievers - they'll attack the hell out of you for supporting the bible, and say God is evil, yet they'll then say that evil doesn't exist - and a child murderer is not evil.Dodgy manifold mental atheistic gymnastics goes on in this place, that's for sure.

Clever, and noted, but I was reffering to God as the one not really responisble. I do not blame Him because He only does this to earn our love. Evil doesn't just harm. Some corrupt priests can heal with the devil's power, just as pure ones can heal with God's power. The devil can cause good things to happen when they shouldn't, just as God can cause good things to happen. The difference is that God does it with love, and the devil does it with hate and no real power. The devil merely copies God.

People on this thread have said that Evil doesn't exist?People have said on this forum that child murderers are not committing evil?Can you point to it?People can commit evil actions and we can believe in the concept of Evil without belief with your bronze-age goatherder godhead.This message has been edited by Charles Knight, 11-21-2004 09:05 PM

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I do not blame Him because He only does this to earn our love

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So if I get a guy to beat the shit out of you and then visit you in the hospital and help you to heal (for which you love me) - I'm the good guy rather than a sicko?

I agree totally with you. I think that some athiests on some level know that just beause they deny God, they can't be protected from the devil.

oh please.....

A child murderer's behavior and acts are described as evil. But did the person commit the crimes or did evil do it? You see evil is a word not an entity that manifest and commits crimes. The problem with blaming evil is that it does not hold the individual responsible for they're actions.. The devil made him do it. Thats is bull shit anyway you slice it. IMO. Shifting the blame to EVIL is so convienant because many do not want to accept the fact that it is the person who commits these evil acts and not some demon within.

Depends on why I got beat up. If I had it coming, sure. Personally, if this really happened, I wouldn't be angry, but that is just me. If God had someone beat me up because I sinned in such a way that He was displeased, I wouldn't be angry. I don't recall ever being angry at God, though I have questioned Him.

You seem to have totally missed the point of my question.Why would you deserve to be beated up?Let me ask again - the only reason you have been beated up - is so I can look after you in the hospital and make you love me.This message has been edited by Charles Knight, 11-21-2004 09:16 PM

Humans are rather deaf and blind to God, so I think He allows some of these things to happen so that we relize that He's there and He loves us. If you weren't intending on forcing me to love you, then sure, I would take the beating in order for you to show me that you love me.

People are just as responsible as the devil in that manner to my belief. They allow themselves to be tricked or commanded by the devil to do such terrible acts.

So if I am beated into a coma and never recover - what did I learn?What if I a baby and burnt to death?

Are you familiar with how argumentation works? It's common for opponents of a position to, for the purpose of argument, adopt that position and then explore the logical contradictions that stem from it.Maybe it wasn't made clear to you, but that's what's going on. I mean, didn't it seem somewhat weird for someone to say that there's no god, but then talk about the qualities god has?I realize that it seems like "mental gymnastics" to you; really, it's just a form of argumentation. We don't really believe your god is evil, because we don't believe your god exists at all. What we're doing is showing you the inconsistency of your own beliefs. I'm sorry that such an advanced technique confuses you, but maybe that's just because atheists tend to be better at reasoning things out than believers, by virtue of so much practice at it.

I belive that you get one last chance to choose God when you die. Further more, babies, small children, and those who haven't heard the word of God are innocent and therefore are accepted into Heaven, at least from what I've heard from my father.