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Author | Topic: Evolution has been Disproven | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
PP, you might find the Is Abiogenesis a fact? topic to be an interesting read. Right now it's at just a 32 message total.
Moose
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ramoss Member (Idle past 643 days) Posts: 3228 Joined: |
NOOOOO, Life did not just 'come from nothing'. There is a nice whole field of study called 'Abiogenesis' that is looking a how it might have happened. Much progress over the last 10 years has been done to understand the way simple organic chemicals react to be able to develop more complex organic chemicals. However, because the information about what actually did happen has been destroyed over the last 3.4 billion years, we can only say 'it could have happend this way', rather than saying 'it did happen this way'. There could be multiple paths that the simple organic material became complex enough to be called life. At this point,we don't know.
We do know that it is likely the earth was full of organic material. When they did a space probe to Titan, they found that the atmosphere of Titan actually had a lot of complex organic material in it. This is signifigent, since Titan is the place in teh solar system that scientists felt was the most like the early earth, and they wanted to see what titan was like. Remember, the definition of 'organic' chemicals is chemicals that include carbon. Since carbon is so plentiful, that leaves a lot of organic chemistry to be done. So, no, at that point, apparently life did not come from 'nothing'. This message has been edited by ramoss, 02-04-2006 09:58 AM
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Jackie Inactive Member |
I was wondering if this had been discussed, or posted , there is so much on the forum to read.
Darwin's warm pond theory testedBy Rebecca Morelle BBC News science reporter BBC NEWS | Science/Nature | Darwin's warm pond idea is tested The organic compounds cling too tightly to the clayLife on Earth was unlikely to have emerged from volcanic springs or hydrothermal vents, according to a leading US researcher.
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Matt P Member (Idle past 4805 days) Posts: 106 From: Tampa FL Joined: |
Deamer has got an interesting bit of work there, and I think his research highlights the difficulties of the hydrothermal vent origin of life. I saw him give a talk in August, and he actually said that the point of this research was to have some fun. He noted that professors can't have fun till after they receive tenure, though...
I'm more inclined towards the shallow lake/prebiotic soup hypothesis, though if we could keep some of the hydrothermal system advantages (like sulfide mineralogy and enhanced catalytic reactivity), that would assist in a number of the difficulties of the origin of life.
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carini Inactive Member |
Just because one guy tried to create life in a jar and couldnt do it doesnt mean it didnt happen. Give him an ocean and a 500 million years and he could probably have done something like that though.
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generaljoe Inactive Member |
by saying life cant come from non-life, are you also saying computers cant compute, because they are made out of rocks?(silicon etc)
also, life is essentially non life (atoms etc) working in an extremely extremely complex community creating an "image" of life, life itself its actions etc, are still based upon chemical reactions
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Captain Charisma Inactive Member |
Hi everyone. First posting so go easy on me!!!
Computers can compute, and our bodies can make chemical reactions. The difference between us is that we can procreate; a computer can't make a baby computer. Although it is true that all things, including life, can be reduced down to the simple molecular mechanisms, only life can grow, adapt and reproduce. So there is still a fairly massive gulf between living organisms and non-living matter.
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1498 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
Although it is true that all things, including life, can be reduced down to the simple molecular mechanisms, only life can grow, adapt and reproduce. Hardly as meaningful as you make it, since we define as "life" anything that can grow, adapt, and reproduce.
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AdminJar Inactive Member |
We're gald that you joined us.
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Captain Charisma Inactive Member |
I'm sorry, I don't think I know exactly what you mean. Could you explain your viewpoint and why you feel that way?
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sidelined Member (Idle past 5939 days) Posts: 3435 From: Edmonton Alberta Canada Joined: |
adamsj
So there is still a fairly massive gulf between living organisms and non-living matter. However, since you agree that, "it is true that all things, including life, can be reduced down to the simple molecular mechanisms", then it stands to follow that the difference is one of relative complexity and not one of a special significance other than our personal involvement in the process of life.
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Chiroptera Inactive Member |
quote: Viruses also grow, adapt, and reproduce. However, biologists have a lot of trouble in classifying them as definitely living organisms or definitely non-living systems. So, as wide as the gulf is, there is at least one group of things that are in that gulf. In fact, the study of abiogenesis exists to try to figure what sorts of other things might also exist in that gulf that will nicely bridge the gulf between living organisms and non-living matter. "Religion is the best business to be in. It's the only one where the customers blame themselves for product failure." -- Ellis Weiner (quoted on the NAiG message board)
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Captain Charisma Inactive Member |
In saying that there is still a large gap between living and non-living matter, I was trying to neutralise the arguement that if living matter and non-living matter are all made of the same stuff, then the issue of the latter transforming into former is of little consequence.
I disagree with this and feel that the fact that there are things like viruses that are in the middle of a very large void does not prove that organisms can go from one side to the other. P.S. I am not religious, but I am curious as to what point were you hoping to make with the quote?
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Chiroptera Inactive Member |
Maybe I don't understand your point. That has happened before.
My point is that whether the gulf between life and non-life is large or small is a matter of perspective. By the way, welcome to EvC. "Religion is the best business to be in. It's the only one where the customers blame themselves for product failure." -- Ellis Weiner (quoted on the NAiG message board)
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Adminnemooseus Administrator Posts: 3976 Joined: |
Per stardard forum operating procedure, this topic is closing down.
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