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Author | Topic: Charismatic Chaos | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
PaulK Member Posts: 17828 Joined: Member Rating: 2.3 |
L A Times
The California Gang database - a secret law enforcement list of alleged gang members and associates is in desperate need of reform and efforts have been going on since 2016
Concerns about CalGang date back to a scathing 2016 state audit, which found it lacked oversight, and that some of the agencies entering alleged gang members, including the LAPD, could not substantiate the claims. Auditors found records for children as young as 1 year old when their names were uploaded, prompting the Legislature in 2017 to put the database under the purview of the attorney general and demand new rules for its use. Until then, it had functioned without state oversight. Officers are accused of using false evidence to place people on the list - a list it is very hard to get a name removed from.
More than 90% of people in the database in 2018 were men of color, predominantly Latino and black, according to data from the California Department of Justice. What a surprise. But I guess the police have to work hard to protect California from those dangerous toddlers.
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9201 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.2 |
Really?
Is your white privilege being attacked? There is no such thing as blacksplaining about racism. Maybe you do not understand what whitesplaining is. Whitesplaining is when those in the dominant group explain to people of the nondominant group how they should feel about racism. Or why things are not so bad, or that the people in the dominant group shouldn't have to feel uncomfortable about racism. Stop 'whitesplaining' racism to me | CNN'Whitesplaining': what it is and how it works I am not sorry it made you mad or uncomfortable. Maybe it will cause you to do a little research and introspection as to why the word exists and why minorities and people of color take offense at it. behaving like the thing you accuse others of
I love how white privilege makes people go to the rationalization that pointing out racism or calling people out on discriminatory actions and behaviors is itself racism. Hyro again did one of his classic strawman arguments that you kindly quoted. I and no one I know of here has been critical of white people on account of their whiteness. This is a lie. I am critical of people because of their racist comments and attitudes. I am white, Hispanic white but white. I have benefitted greatly from my white privilege.If you think pointing out white privilege is some sort of racist attack on white people than you need to examine your own attitudes about race and discrimination. Get mad. Why are you mad? Are you uncomfortable? Do you wish people of color would just quit stirring the pot and not point out racism. We are done waiting, we are done accepting the status quo. We are done being treated like second class citizens. Edited by Theodoric, : No reason given.Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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Tangle Member Posts: 9514 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.8 |
Theo writes: Is your white privilege being attacked? Not at all, sticks and stones etc, isn't that the point of white privilege, that we're above all that crap? No, it just pisses me off that you're going to make it worse just as I thought equality and diversity was making progress.
There is no such thing as blacksplaining about racism. Maybe you do not understand what whitesplaining is. You need to understand what you're doing when you use racist terms when you're trying fight racism. Don't you see that you doing exactly what you accuse others of?
I am not sorry it made you mad or uncomfortable. Maybe it will cause you to do a little research and introspection as to why the word exists and why minorities and people of color take offense at it. I understand why people take offence, that's why you and no-one else should do it.
I love how white privilege makes people go to the rationalization that pointing out racism or calling people out on discriminatory actions and behaviors is itself racism. Don't you get racism at all? Calling me 'white privileged' in that way is identical to me calling you whatever epithet you don't enjoy hearing and object to. How do you think that's helping?Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0
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Hyroglyphx,addressing Theodoric writes: I will respond to this. I think I am beginning to understand all of this a bit better. Nobody suggested that i should necessarily feel guilty (which I don't so much) for the sins of my ancestors. The keyword that we are looking for is awareness. Nobody can make me feel like crap unless they bully me regarding my entitlement and privilege issues yet I think that sometimes I go looking for a "fight" just to feel better about myself. Quite frankly I also think that some of us need to be confronted about our unconscious attitudes and challenged. Call it tough love. Here's the deal for white people at large. If you are white you must totally acquiesce, must self-immolate, admit that you are a racist piece of shit, drive the narrative that minorities are oppressed at all times of the day and unless you take direct action you cannot overcome your sins. Because I dared to go against the pantheon, which is because I think its wrong, it is itself inherently and ironically racist, and because it is dangerous for race relations, I'm now vilified as a racist. Believe whatever it is you'd like to believe. But I'd like to think you are intelligent enough to see the difference. You and people of your ilk is what either hermetically seals actual racists in their toxic ideology or helps to create them bit by bit. Ask yourself if this is helpful... Does it work with Faith or does it drive her deeper in to her abyss of garbage thinking? Edited by AdminPhat, : No reason given.
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9201 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.2 |
Whitesplaining and white privilege are not racist terms. They are an attempt to get privileged whites to understand the racism in their attitudes toward race. I guess you are unwilling to accept that reality.
Me pointing out racism is not a racist act no matter that your white privilege wants it to be. Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9201 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.2 |
Phat sometimes you drive me crazy with how obtuse you can be, but sometimes you just get it. I know I challenge you a lot. I hope you understand I do this so you will open your mind. And you do.
Thank you. Here is a website that explains and shows implicit bias(discriminatory attitudes). It can be a tough slog. I had to honestly look at some racist attitudes I have after I took it. If people will look at it with honesty they will see that they have implicit bias for no reason other than that is how their live has been lived. No real reason other than ingrained racism and bias. Select a Test is it easy to look at this dark side of ourselves? No. But it needs to be looked at if we want to live in a better world. Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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Tangle Member Posts: 9514 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.8
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Theo writes: Whitesplaining and white privilege are not racist terms. Of course they are, they are terms that target individuals because of the colour of their skin and only because of the colour of their skin. and are applied to all those of that skin colour indiscriminately. It's the definition of racism.
Me pointing out racism is not a racist act no matter that your white privilege wants it to be. If you label all white people indiscriminately in the angry and aggressive way that you do using that kind of language you are being just as racist as those you accuse of it and you will only alienate those white people - the vast majority - that support your cause. You have rightful grievances, don't lash out at those who would help you fix them.Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
I dont know if this is implicit prejudice or not, but it has been my rather limited experience that most atheists are white. That's my bias anyway.
Edited by AdminPhat, : No reason given.
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Tangle Member Posts: 9514 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.8 |
I've no idea. On this side of the pond nobody discusses religion - it's a non-subject, mostly irrelevant - so no way of knowing unless there's some formal surveys somewhere.
There may be a big difference between the developed and undeveloped world of course. ABE
quote: Atheism in the African diaspora - Wikipedia This kind of crap (below) is really annoying. Atheists are just people that lack a belief in god, apart from that they're just ordinary people with their ordinary biases and prejudices. Hardly any of us are involved in any sort of 'movement' or group. And the concept of 'tacitly' racist is insulting and in itself racist. We really need to stop banding that word about randomly, it's losing its actual meaning and has begun to mean the slightest imaginary slight. Real racism is an evil that need harsh treatment, 'implicit' slights don't come anywhere near it.
quote: Edited by Tangle, : No reason given.Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Tangle writes:
That's too broad a definition. Racism implies that one group is superior to another group and assumed superiority results in the gathering of power to the "superior" group. You are not racist if you are powerless. ... they are terms that target individuals because of the colour of their skin and only because of the colour of their skin."I'm Fallen and I can't get up!"
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jar Member (Idle past 423 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
ringo writes: You are not racist if you are powerless. Nonsense. You can be a helpless racist when powerless. But racism itself is not a problem rather it is behavior regardless of the cause that is the issue. Racism is only an issue when it extends to acts and those acts are wrong regardless of motivation.
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
jar writes:
You contradict yourself. You can not have racist behavior without power. You can be a helpless racist when powerless. But racism itself is not a problem rather it is behavior regardless of the cause that is the issue."I'm Fallen and I can't get up!"
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
mmmmm not sure I agree. But I think its a rabbit trail off of Charismatic behavior in general anyway. Not that we have ever really been on topic.
The only way I know to drive out evil from the country is by the constructive method of filling it with good.Calvin Coolidge "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " As the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, so the denial of God is the height of foolishness.-RC Sproul, Essential Truths of the Christian Faith - You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do. Anne Lamott Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it.~Andre Gide
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes: But I think its a rabbit trail off of Charismatic behavior in general anyway. OP writes:
He would find the same Pharisees that He found the first time - mouthing, "Lord! Lord!" while passing by the half-dead traveler on the road from Jerusalem to Jericho. Were Jesus to return tomorrow, would He find contemporary public Christianity to be applauded or would He see it as reprehensible?"I'm Fallen and I can't get up!"
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Tangle writes: I was curious about what percentage of younger self-proclaimed atheists are influenced much by Hitchens, Dawkins, Dennet, and Harris? Many of the same arguments used by these and a few other atheist activists resurface whenever confronting a younger, educated person. I have noted, however, that they are not so much anti-Christian as they are simply "irrelevant Christian" focused. And I have found that many were onetime Catholics (the religion and culture of their parents) since abandoned and that few of them think they need to meet Jesus. Which is ok, I suppose for now...but I think everyone will meet him at some point. Atheists are just people that lack a belief in God, apart from that they're just ordinary people with their ordinary biases and prejudices. Hardly any of us are involved in any sort of 'movement' or group.The only way I know to drive out evil from the country is by the constructive method of filling it with good.Calvin Coolidge "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " As the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, so the denial of God is the height of foolishness.-RC Sproul, Essential Truths of the Christian Faith - You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do. Anne Lamott Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it.~Andre Gide
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