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Author Topic:   Paul Harvey's take on prayer in public/Xmas (In general, a "freedom of speech" topic)
bob_gray
Member (Idle past 5043 days)
Posts: 243
From: Virginia
Joined: 05-03-2004


Message 56 of 165 (173937)
01-05-2005 12:18 AM
Reply to: Message 47 by Hangdawg13
01-04-2005 2:05 PM


which principles are uniquely Christian?
Hangdawg13,
I had a similar question to JustinCy. While I understand that many of the men who were involved in the creation of the US were indeed Christians I have never been able to pinpoint the Christian influence. Exactly which principles of the founding of the US are uniquely Christian? It seems to me that if none of them are unique to Christianity then it would be misleading to say that the nation was founded on Christian principles. In fact you could almost argue that the country was founded in spite of Christian principles (ie. freedom of religion) rather than because of them (ie. one true god and if you don't believe you are going to hell so you better be a believer)
Thanks in advance,
BG

This message is a reply to:
 Message 47 by Hangdawg13, posted 01-04-2005 2:05 PM Hangdawg13 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 57 by JustinC, posted 01-05-2005 3:27 AM bob_gray has not replied
 Message 58 by Tal, posted 01-05-2005 3:28 AM bob_gray has replied
 Message 80 by Hangdawg13, posted 01-05-2005 1:18 PM bob_gray has replied

bob_gray
Member (Idle past 5043 days)
Posts: 243
From: Virginia
Joined: 05-03-2004


Message 89 of 165 (174221)
01-05-2005 8:31 PM
Reply to: Message 58 by Tal
01-05-2005 3:28 AM


Re: which principles are uniquely Christian?
Tal,
Thanks for your reply. I was unable to locate in the quote you provided the principles of the founding of the US that are uniquely Christian. I was hoping you might be able to clarify that.
Thanks,
BG

This message is a reply to:
 Message 58 by Tal, posted 01-05-2005 3:28 AM Tal has not replied

bob_gray
Member (Idle past 5043 days)
Posts: 243
From: Virginia
Joined: 05-03-2004


Message 90 of 165 (174224)
01-05-2005 8:46 PM
Reply to: Message 83 by JustinC
01-05-2005 3:02 PM


Re: which principles are uniquely Christian?
One that comes to mind immediately is "all men are created equal," but it was also written by an intellectual deist. I'm not sure that principle is exclusive to Christianity either.
Not only that but I think that it is clear from the history of Christianity that at the founding of the US all men were _not_ created equal. I think that this is another example of an American principle that occurred in spite of Christianity and not because of it. Many of the Europeans who first came to the North American continent came so that they could be religiously intolerant, not for liberty and justice for all. Christianity later appropriated the idea that all men are created equal because it is a good idea. And that didn't even take for a long time because look at how many racist Christians there are. "Equality" is not a uniquely Christian principle.
ABE: Glad you like the comics. I found that the comic I used for my avatar was pretty typical of many of the graduate students I know and it kills me every time I read it.
This message has been edited by bob_gray, 01-05-2005 20:49 AM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 83 by JustinC, posted 01-05-2005 3:02 PM JustinC has not replied

bob_gray
Member (Idle past 5043 days)
Posts: 243
From: Virginia
Joined: 05-03-2004


Message 91 of 165 (174228)
01-05-2005 9:05 PM
Reply to: Message 80 by Hangdawg13
01-05-2005 1:18 PM


Re: which principles are uniquely Christian?
Hangdawg13 writes:
A nation is founded on more than mere laws. It is founded by lots and lots of people working, living, eating, learning, and in times of war fighting together. Many of these people's beliefs belonged to some form of Christianity and as such their communities reflected their beliefs, and the wisdom written by the founding fathers also reflected their beliefs (I realize some were deists).
That seems reasonable, and that was what I was trying to get at by saying that many of the founders of the US were Christians. I was just trying to get some clarification on the statement in the OP which was being defended:
quote:
(From Paul Harvey)
Yes, and this is the United States of America, a country founded on Christian principles.
I was trying to find out which Christian principles those were. Clearly the founders were influenced by their understanding of the world (religion) but it has always seemed to me that they wrote the founding documents carefully to keep that out. In other words (hypothetically speaking) if you didn't know that the people who wrote the documents were Christians, what specifically would lead you to believe that they were from reading those documents?
BG

This message is a reply to:
 Message 80 by Hangdawg13, posted 01-05-2005 1:18 PM Hangdawg13 has not replied

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