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Author
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Topic: The first 3 chapters of Genesis
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Re: Well, it starts as usual with Robin misrepresenting what has been said
I'm still waiting to hear why Jar thinks they were punished, since he doesn't think they were punished for eating the fruit of KGE.
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Re: Well, it starts as usual with Robin misrepresenting what has been said
God did not expell Adam & Eve from the Garden of Eden because they ate from the Tree of Knowledge but because God feared that they would then eat from the Tree of Life and become (note the word become) immortal. Comments like these by Jar were what gave me the idea that Jar would not characterize what God did to them as "punishment"--for if so, it would be punishment for something they had not yet done. Edited by robinrohan, : No reason given.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 176 by robinrohan, posted 09-18-2006 11:03 PM | | robinrohan has not replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 183 of 307 (350333)
09-19-2006 2:09 PM
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Reply to: Message 182 by Brian
09-19-2006 2:07 PM
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God obviously punished them because they ate from the tree of good and evil. If they hadn't eaten the fruit from that then no action would have been taken by God. Not being allowed to eat from the tree of life was part of the punishment for eating from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Exactly.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 182 by Brian, posted 09-19-2006 2:07 PM | | Brian has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 184 by Brian, posted 09-19-2006 2:44 PM | | robinrohan has not replied | | | Message 185 by Percy, posted 09-19-2006 3:06 PM | | robinrohan has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 186 of 307 (350355)
09-19-2006 3:14 PM
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Reply to: Message 185 by Percy
09-19-2006 3:06 PM
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You mean that your and Brian's interpretation is that it would have been okay with God if Adam and Eve had eaten from the Tree of Life? He wasn't worried that they might live forever, but he didn't want them to know good from evil? They had been eating from the Tree of Life all along, but God took the immortality away when they disobeyed and didn't let them eat from it again.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 185 by Percy, posted 09-19-2006 3:06 PM | | Percy has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 187 by jar, posted 09-19-2006 3:19 PM | | robinrohan has replied | | | Message 208 by Percy, posted 09-20-2006 5:54 PM | | robinrohan has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Re: Literal or allegorical?
What is the issue you have exactly with this piece of scripture? I was objecting to interpretations by others that God did not punish Adam and Eve for eating from the KGE.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 188 by Hyroglyphx, posted 09-19-2006 3:25 PM | | Hyroglyphx has not replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 190 of 307 (350365)
09-19-2006 3:38 PM
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Reply to: Message 187 by jar
09-19-2006 3:19 PM
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It says allowed, not allowed to continue or allowed to eat more. Well, ok. The story is not clear on that point.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 187 by jar, posted 09-19-2006 3:19 PM | | jar has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 191 by jar, posted 09-19-2006 3:51 PM | | robinrohan has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 192 of 307 (350393)
09-19-2006 4:14 PM
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Reply to: Message 191 by jar
09-19-2006 3:51 PM
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Re: Way too funny.
Robin, it is VERY clear. It would be clear if God had issued a commandment against eating from the Tree of Life, but no such commandment was issued. The Tree of Life was mentioned in Chapter 2 as being there all along.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 191 by jar, posted 09-19-2006 3:51 PM | | jar has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 193 by jar, posted 09-19-2006 4:29 PM | | robinrohan has not replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 197 of 307 (350441)
09-19-2006 5:54 PM
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Reply to: Message 194 by Brian
09-19-2006 5:31 PM
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Re: Way too funny.
Why were they not allowed to eat from the Tree of Life? Apparently they were at first. The story is not clear: 1. Maybe you have to eat from KGE before the immortalizing effects of the Tree of Life will work. You have to know good and evil before you can be immortal. So they had been eating from it all along, but it had no effect. 2. Maybe they were working their way around the garden slowly and hadn't gotten to it yet, not knowing of its importance. 3. Maybe the Tree of Life had fruit that didn't look very appetizing, and they passed it by. Edited by robinrohan, : No reason given.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 194 by Brian, posted 09-19-2006 5:31 PM | | Brian has not replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 209 of 307 (350776)
09-20-2006 6:10 PM
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Reply to: Message 208 by Percy
09-20-2006 5:54 PM
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One thing you can say for certain, God punished Adam and Eve for eating of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. That was my main point in the OP. Jar has denied this.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 208 by Percy, posted 09-20-2006 5:54 PM | | Percy has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 210 by Percy, posted 09-20-2006 6:28 PM | | robinrohan has replied | | | Message 212 by jar, posted 09-20-2006 7:01 PM | | robinrohan has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 211 of 307 (350792)
09-20-2006 7:01 PM
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Reply to: Message 210 by Percy
09-20-2006 6:28 PM
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Are you daft? No, Percy, I am not. The reason I started this thread in the first place was that Jar was setting forth this bizarre interpretation in another thread. In that thread, he said this:
Jar writes: God did not expell Adam & Eve from the Garden of Eden because they ate from the Tree of Knowledge but because God feared that they would then eat from the Tree of Life and become (note the word become) immortal Over there, he was claiming that Adam and Eve couldn't have been punished for eating from the KGE because they didn't know the difference between right and wrong. Perhaps he's changed his tune on this thread.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 210 by Percy, posted 09-20-2006 6:28 PM | | Percy has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 240 by Percy, posted 09-21-2006 9:57 AM | | robinrohan has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 213 of 307 (350794)
09-20-2006 7:04 PM
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Reply to: Message 212 by jar
09-20-2006 7:01 PM
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Re: You are doing it yet again Robin.
Look at the the post right above you, Jar. I just quoted it. Here it is again:
Jar writes: God did not expell Adam & Eve from the Garden of Eden because they ate from the Tree of Knowledge but because God feared that they would then eat from the Tree of Life and become (note the word become) immortal
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 212 by jar, posted 09-20-2006 7:01 PM | | jar has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Re: You are doing it yet again Robin.
And then there's this:
Is it disobedience? Yes and no. Adam and Eve could not know that it is wrong to disobey God until after they had eaten from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. They simply did not know right from wrong. From Gods perspective, He gave an order that was impossible to be obeyed.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 213 by robinrohan, posted 09-20-2006 7:04 PM | | robinrohan has not replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 216 of 307 (350800)
09-20-2006 7:16 PM
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Reply to: Message 215 by jar
09-20-2006 7:12 PM
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Re: You are doing it yet again Robin.
And this
It does not matter if it is a command or not. Until they ate from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil they had no means of knowing they should obey it. Ok, I will ask you then again: Why were Adam and Eve punished?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 215 by jar, posted 09-20-2006 7:12 PM | | jar has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 219 of 307 (350804)
09-20-2006 7:26 PM
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Reply to: Message 217 by jar
09-20-2006 7:19 PM
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Re: You are doing it yet again Robin.
Until they ate from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil they had no means of knowing they should obey it. Why would Adam and Eve be punished if they did not know it was wrong to disobey God?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 217 by jar, posted 09-20-2006 7:19 PM | | jar has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 223 of 307 (350817)
09-20-2006 8:22 PM
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Reply to: Message 220 by jar
09-20-2006 7:36 PM
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Re: You are doing it yet again Robin.
So, Jar, you are claiming that when God says this
And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: Gen 2:17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. that Adam does not recognize this as a threat?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 220 by jar, posted 09-20-2006 7:36 PM | | jar has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 224 by kuresu, posted 09-20-2006 8:39 PM | | robinrohan has replied | | | Message 226 by jar, posted 09-20-2006 8:54 PM | | robinrohan has replied |
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