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Author Topic:   If it can be, how can the "Absence of Evidence" be "Evidence of Absence?".
Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 19 of 309 (533862)
11-03-2009 10:34 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by bluescat48
10-22-2009 6:00 PM


It has been stated here at EvC and at other evo/creo fora the absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
So be it. When I say I don't believe in any gods I get asked what evidence is there that no gods exist?
From my own experience I find that those who believe in Jehovah reject Zeus. My point is what evidence are these Theists using to reject Zeus, Ra, Thor, Xipe, etc.
I personally don't have a problem with how people come to being atheists. I think that is fine. I do take exception of the "absence of evidence, is evidence of absence" schtick though.
It's simply not true, because "evidence" is positive. A lack of evidence in one direction is not positive evidence in another by default.
Again, it was theorized that water was on the moon. They sought it out but found none. IOW, there was an absence of evidence. That does not mean that there is now "evidence" that no water exists on the moon, it simply means that there was no evidence to suggest there is.
We now know otherwise that there is water on the moon. That being the case, if the phrase "absence of evidence is EVIDENCE of absence" is true, then no water could ever be found since this is a positive declaration.
As this relates to gods and the supernatural, I am not suggesting that because it is theoretically possible for such to exist that you then have to follow some arbitrary rule to adhere to the possibility. I say that especially in light of anything being theoretically possible.
But absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." --John Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by bluescat48, posted 10-22-2009 6:00 PM bluescat48 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 24 by Perdition, posted 11-03-2009 11:56 AM Hyroglyphx has replied

Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 25 of 309 (533891)
11-03-2009 12:37 PM
Reply to: Message 24 by Perdition
11-03-2009 11:56 AM


You've said this before, but it's wrong. You can have evidence for something that's wrong.
You cannot prove something doesn't exist if it in fact does not exist.
To go back to the snowy camper analogy. Say you wake up and find tracks by your tent. That is evidence that something walked by your tent. Since the tracks are not preserved enough to show you exactly what walked by, it is equally evidence that a person walked by as that a bear walked by. You would then need other evidence to narrow down the options.
That isn't a lack of evidence, so how does it relate to the current discussion?
If there is a lack of evidence, that is a very good reason to tentatively reject the claim.
I never said or implied that anyone would have to accept a claim without evidence, only that the phrase the "absence of evidence, is evidence of absence."

"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." --John Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 24 by Perdition, posted 11-03-2009 11:56 AM Perdition has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 26 by Perdition, posted 11-03-2009 1:12 PM Hyroglyphx has not replied

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