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Author Topic:   The Geological Timescale is Fiction whose only reality is stacks of rock
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(3)
Message 46 of 1257 (787937)
07-24-2016 1:04 AM
Reply to: Message 43 by Faith
07-23-2016 11:59 PM


Re: Just a brief reply
Stop telling me what I'm saying is "not true," when the point is I'm giving my argument and I know you have a different opinion. Of course, it's what the argument is about, and I expect to have to try to prove it. That doesn't make my argument false.

Opinions, arguments, and beliefs all must depend on evidence. Some opinions, arguments and beliefs are supported by the evidence, while others are not. Not all interpretations are of equal value or accuracy!

We know you are giving your argument and opinions, and have been doing so here for years, but your argument and opinions are not supported by the evidence. That does make them false, or in scientific terms, they are disproved.

The fact that you can't accept this shows that you are doing religious apologetics, not science. Science relies on evidence not beliefs. In science, when hypotheses are disproved by the evidence they must be discarded or modified.


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 43 by Faith, posted 07-23-2016 11:59 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(4)
Message 155 of 1257 (788108)
07-26-2016 10:22 AM
Reply to: Message 150 by Faith
07-26-2016 4:38 AM


Re: Cretaceous dinosaur fossils in area that was underwater for the whole time period
But of course your faith is in OE geology, mine is in the Flood. I know I need better evidence, but I have faith that it's out there.

And of course that's the difference between those who do science and those who do religious apologetics.

Oh, and it is incorrect to refer to scientists having "faith" or "belief." Scientists follow the evidence where it leads.

Add: I see someone used the word "trust" for science upthread. That's a far better term than "faith" or "belief."

Edited by Coyote, : No reason given.


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 150 by Faith, posted 07-26-2016 4:38 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 157 by Faith, posted 07-26-2016 11:17 AM Coyote has acknowledged this reply

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(2)
Message 271 of 1257 (788533)
08-01-2016 5:45 PM
Reply to: Message 270 by Faith
08-01-2016 5:16 PM


Re: Time-stratigraphy vs Litho-stratigraphy
It's funny how people just take the dating system for granted as if you could know how old something is yourself and agree out of your own knowledge.

Tree rings do just fine for this.

There are several other very nice methods as well. Your objections are overruled by the evidence.


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 270 by Faith, posted 08-01-2016 5:16 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(3)
Message 391 of 1257 (788955)
08-08-2016 2:33 PM
Reply to: Message 387 by Faith
08-08-2016 1:32 PM


Re: Where did the seafloor/landscape go?
Your explanations for things are becoming increasingly divorced from reality.

This is also a good part of why most folks pay no attention to the claims made by creationists.


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 387 by Faith, posted 08-08-2016 1:32 PM Faith has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 407 by edge, posted 08-08-2016 5:20 PM Coyote has not yet responded

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 417 of 1257 (789003)
08-09-2016 10:01 AM
Reply to: Message 415 by PaulK
08-09-2016 6:47 AM


Re: Where did the seafloor/landscape go?
I wouldn't think that a wooden dwelling that has rotted away would leave much that you would recognise.

I've actually seen archaeological reports that deal with buildings rotted away or destroyed by fire. If conditions are right, the patterns of nails in the soil can give a lot of information about the locations and sometimes even the types of buildings that were there!


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 415 by PaulK, posted 08-09-2016 6:47 AM PaulK has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 418 by jar, posted 08-09-2016 10:29 AM Coyote has acknowledged this reply

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 424 of 1257 (789031)
08-09-2016 4:12 PM
Reply to: Message 423 by PaulK
08-09-2016 1:39 PM


Re: Where did the seafloor/landscape go?
PaulK writes:

So what is the problem ? What are you actually having trouble with ?

That's easy!

Anything that might, or might be construed, to support evolution or old earth.


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 423 by PaulK, posted 08-09-2016 1:39 PM PaulK has not yet responded

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(1)
Message 470 of 1257 (789119)
08-10-2016 10:42 PM
Reply to: Message 469 by NoNukes
08-10-2016 9:27 PM


Re: Just the same as today.
the sediment accumulation process...?

That's easy to understand.

Folks dust their houses and sweep their floors, don't they?

When you clean your house most of the extra sediment ends up outside.

That process of sediment accumulation, over long periods of time, can create quite a thick deposit if not disturbed.

But you don't see massive die-offs with the steadily accumulating sediment in your back yard, do you?

This is the exact process that forms the geological layers, but they had a considerable head start. The new layers forming from your kitchen floor dust will take a while longer...


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 469 by NoNukes, posted 08-10-2016 9:27 PM NoNukes has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 479 by Faith, posted 08-11-2016 9:45 AM Coyote has not yet responded

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(1)
Message 489 of 1257 (789154)
08-11-2016 10:54 AM
Reply to: Message 482 by Faith
08-11-2016 10:15 AM


Re: misusing logic -- yes you are, jar
there may be only the Flood left as the reasonable alternative and no general assertion can disprove that. If you are going to claim it wouldn't be the reasonable alternative you have to prove it.

The evidence disproved the flood story 200 years ago, and in the years since then the evidence disproving the flood story has just gotten stronger.

There's more evidence for Santa Claus than the flood! (Why, I saw him at the mall just last year!)


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 482 by Faith, posted 08-11-2016 10:15 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 490 by Faith, posted 08-11-2016 11:11 AM Coyote has not yet responded

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 541 of 1257 (789228)
08-11-2016 8:05 PM


This link, if you will only take the time to look at it, explains soil horizons down to bedrock.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soil_horizon


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 584 of 1257 (789297)
08-12-2016 10:11 PM
Reply to: Message 582 by Faith
08-12-2016 9:11 PM


it seems to me that's a mental set that wouldn't think of asking the questions I'm asking...

That's because the questions you're asking were addressed and answered 200 years ago--there was no global flood during historic times.

Why should modern geologists address questions that have been settled for 200 years? Questions for which the evidence in the intervening 200 years has only confirmed those initial answers? There was no global flood during historic times!

Face it: you are posting from religious belief, not real-world evidence. Your beliefs have been disproved for over 200 years and:

All the king's horses and all the king's men
Couldn't put Humpty together again.
Nor could all your belief...

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 582 by Faith, posted 08-12-2016 9:11 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 586 by Faith, posted 08-12-2016 10:29 PM Coyote has responded

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(1)
Message 588 of 1257 (789301)
08-12-2016 10:43 PM
Reply to: Message 586 by Faith
08-12-2016 10:29 PM


My questions have nothing to do with the Flood. That's a figment of YOUR imagination. The questions come from pondering the strata and the geological interpretations thereof, which I find laughable. The only role the Flood plays in that is freeing me from those ideas.

Your posts come courtesy of the blinders of belief, as you have told us so many times.

You know nothing about real geology and strata and the rest, and you couldn't accept the evidence if you did know it.

You really should not try and pretend what you are doing is science, as your posts clearly show otherwise and you have stated time and again that you are following the bible, not the real-world evidence.

At least be honest about what you are doing!

If you just admit that you are posting your beliefs quite pretending that there is any scientific evidence for those beliefs, I think you would be better off. You probably would be a lot happier as you are reaping a lot of grief in pretending those beliefs have scientific backing.

That issue was settled over 200 years ago, and there's no putting Humpty back together again.


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 586 by Faith, posted 08-12-2016 10:29 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(2)
Message 593 of 1257 (789307)
08-13-2016 1:53 AM
Reply to: Message 592 by Faith
08-13-2016 1:34 AM


You find it insulting that I consider it ridiculous.

I don't think we find it insulting.

Rather, I think most of us find it incredible that you can ignore so much evidence that says your ideas are flat-out wrong.

Many of us are scientists, and we find there is no value in mistakes and errors. What's the use of something that's just wrong?


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 592 by Faith, posted 08-13-2016 1:34 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 594 by Faith, posted 08-13-2016 2:17 AM Coyote has responded

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(1)
Message 603 of 1257 (789322)
08-13-2016 5:57 AM
Reply to: Message 594 by Faith
08-13-2016 2:17 AM


Is there something wrong in my sketch of scientific processes as used in constructing ancient time periods?

It is tempting, and pretty close to correct, to say that you have never been right about anything pertaining to science.


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 594 by Faith, posted 08-13-2016 2:17 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 606 by Faith, posted 08-13-2016 10:49 AM Coyote has not yet responded

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 762 of 1257 (789754)
08-18-2016 10:31 PM
Reply to: Message 761 by jar
08-18-2016 7:43 PM


Re: Time for a summary
Faith simply rejects all of the evidence, all of the science, all of the physics, geology, astronomy, chemistry, paleontology, archeology, all of the reality that does not confirm her myth of a Young Earth.

And when you reject evidence in favor of myth, you can't claim to be doing science.

In fact, you are doing the exact opposite of science.


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 761 by jar, posted 08-18-2016 7:43 PM jar has acknowledged this reply

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 334 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(1)
Message 805 of 1257 (790037)
08-24-2016 9:37 AM
Reply to: Message 803 by dwise1
08-24-2016 1:40 AM


That's how the scientific method works! You have an idea that might explain something. So you present it. The first iteration gets most of the things wrong, so you regroup and attempt to reexplain.

Faith isn't doing science, but apologetics.

There's a whole different method involved in that, and it bears no resemblance to the scientific method.


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 803 by dwise1, posted 08-24-2016 1:40 AM dwise1 has not yet responded

  
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