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Author Topic:   Atheism is a belief (Why Atheists don't believe part 2)
ohnhai
Member (Idle past 5191 days)
Posts: 649
From: Melbourne, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2004


Message 236 of 302 (316532)
05-31-2006 10:10 AM
Reply to: Message 226 by Larni
05-31-2006 6:44 AM


Re: Why the default position is as it is
Larni writes:
Once the child cottons on to the fact that it is not the only thing real in the universe it has the capacity to learn about gods and spirits and make a value judgement.
Then, naturally the toddler will tend to inherit their parent’s worldview, and included in that is their Parent’s religion.
The God or Gods you believe in is, in the majority of cases, simply a matter of to whom you were born. As an Atheist I have a hard time reconciling ”Truth’ and religion, when what god you believe is the ”One True God’ is usually made through accident of birth.
If you were raised by Christian parents, think on this. Had you been born to Muslim parents instead, you would be praying to Allah instead of Jesus.
If you are one who claims to have had an epiphany that confirmed your religion to you, then in this alternate universe, your epiphany would have simply confirmed Allah as undeniably real.
If Belief in any one god is as flimsy and arbitrary as this then that is a very weak foundation to assert absolute truth for any of them.
For me Atheism is a belief. I believe that the God/s do not exist. It has to be a belief as I cant actually prove it to be 100%true. But the lack of solid evidence in the God/s’ favour (and not through lack of people looking) makes me reasonably confident in my belief. There is the big difference between a Theist and an Atheist:
The majority of Atheists would honestly state:
I Freely admit that my belief in the non-existence of the God/s could be wrong. As I can’t prove 100% their lack of existence it would be dishonest of me to say other wise. Though I firmly and resolutely BELIVE that the God/s do NOT exist, IF I was to come across some evidence that was UNDENIABLE, that proved the existence of the God/s then I would have to re-adjust my world view accordingly.
You would be hard pressed to get the majority of Theists to honestly state:
I Freely admit that my belief in the existence of the God could be wrong. Though I believe God to exist, it would be dishonest of me not to acknowledge as a human I am not infallible. Though I firmly and resolutely BELIVE that the God/s Do exist, IF I was to come across some evidence that was UNDENIABLE, that undermined his existence, then I would have to re-adjust my world view accordingly.
That, either way you slice it, is the difference between Atheistic , and Theistic belief.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 226 by Larni, posted 05-31-2006 6:44 AM Larni has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 241 by jar, posted 05-31-2006 10:51 AM ohnhai has not replied
 Message 242 by Larni, posted 05-31-2006 10:54 AM ohnhai has replied
 Message 248 by riVeRraT, posted 05-31-2006 3:12 PM ohnhai has replied

ohnhai
Member (Idle past 5191 days)
Posts: 649
From: Melbourne, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2004


Message 271 of 302 (316710)
05-31-2006 8:00 PM
Reply to: Message 248 by riVeRraT
05-31-2006 3:12 PM


Re: Why the default position is as it is
riVeRraT writes:
I Freely admit that my belief in the non-existence of the God/s could be wrong. As I can’t prove 100% their lack of existence it would be dishonest of me to say other wise. Though I firmly and resolutely BELIVE that the God/s do NOT exist, IF I was to come across some evidence that was UNDENIABLE, that proved the existence of the God/s then I would have to re-adjust my world view accordingly.
This is not dogma?
Not in the slightest. This is an open and painfully honest statement of my belief. It’s not written in any book or enshrined by a religious organization as what you HAVE to believe, thus it is not dogma.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 248 by riVeRraT, posted 05-31-2006 3:12 PM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 291 by riVeRraT, posted 06-01-2006 10:07 AM ohnhai has not replied

ohnhai
Member (Idle past 5191 days)
Posts: 649
From: Melbourne, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2004


Message 273 of 302 (316719)
05-31-2006 8:30 PM
Reply to: Message 242 by Larni
05-31-2006 10:54 AM


Re: Why the default position is as it is
Larni writes:
Is this not the position of the agnostic?
No. An Agnostic is uncertain as to the existence of the God/s. an Atheist {strong} has no uncertainty as to the existence of the God/s. While its true that an Atheist {strong} can not prove this stance as this would require the proof of a negative (thus requiring knowledge of EVERYTHING) that doesn’t mean it’s an un tenable position. It’s is fair and valid to hold this view as a belief.
I am certain that the God/s don’t exist. Absolutely certain. I truly and utterly believe this to be the case. However, I freely admit I could be wrong. This stance is not, in the least bit, uncertain, not fuzzy round the edges, and thus not Agnostic.
Larni writes:
However my point was that the default position of every human being is that of non-belief in religious doctorine and that we make an active choice by ascribing to a religion. Someone who is not religious only needs to make a chice about religions he has been exposed to.
I concur. The second half of my post was a more general comment to the thread and not a rebuttal of your stance (sorry for any confusion)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 242 by Larni, posted 05-31-2006 10:54 AM Larni has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 287 by Larni, posted 06-01-2006 8:48 AM ohnhai has not replied

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