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Author Topic:   The Meaning Of The Trinity
jaywill
Member (Idle past 2055 days)
Posts: 4519
From: VA USA
Joined: 12-05-2005


Message 191 of 1864 (782068)
04-15-2016 7:50 AM


Of course the Trinity is a reality. Anyone wanting to start a new religion would probably never have as a central teaching something so objectively problematic as a doctrine of a three-one God.
But the Trinity is Someone man can experience and experience forever. Yet man can hardly explain. Not being able to fully explain something is not an impediment to a person experiencing and enjoying something.
The skeptical assume that a Christian's failure to explain fully how God could be three-one means the truth of such a concept is not real. That is the assumption. "Oh, God is mysterious. Oh, God is a wonderful mystery. Why, that must mean that your God is not real. Everyone knows that what you experience you can always explain."
There is no need for this assumption. Even in the natural life there are some matters which men enjoy but find it very difficult to explain.
We experience gravity. We benefit from gravity. Gravity is hard to explain. Try explaining the curvature of space - time. Sure, you can talk a lot about it. I doubt anyone really understands how space could be curved. And the people I push on it often dazzle you with mathematical speak as a smoke screen.
But a child knows about falling and something about gravity. The three-oneness of God is a wonderful mystery that man can, and even must experience and enjoy.
God is the Father. God is the Son. God is the Holy Spirit.
Ultimately God is for man to experience.
" The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all." (Eph. 13:14)
That verse is an encouragement to the believers to be occupied with the enjoyment of the mysterious three-one Divine Being.

Replies to this message:
 Message 193 by Phat, posted 04-15-2016 10:49 AM jaywill has replied
 Message 194 by ringo, posted 04-15-2016 11:52 AM jaywill has not replied
 Message 207 by LamarkNewAge, posted 07-22-2016 1:07 PM jaywill has not replied

  
jaywill
Member (Idle past 2055 days)
Posts: 4519
From: VA USA
Joined: 12-05-2005


Message 195 of 1864 (782080)
04-15-2016 11:55 AM
Reply to: Message 193 by Phat
04-15-2016 10:49 AM


Re: Work It Because He Is Worth It
quote:
Yet are we expected to simply enjoy the presence of such a Being or are we expected to joyfully put in work for Him?
The work is His work. It is Christ living in us. The work is by His life, by His power, according to His will and guidance and by His grace.
Notice that Paul said it was the grace of God which was in him which caused him to labor more abundantly than all the apostles.
" ... the grace of God unto me did not turn out to be in vain, but, on the contrary, I labored more abundantly than all of them, yet not I but the grace of God which is with me." (1 Cor. 15:10)
He labored (worked) more abundantly than even the twelve apostles. Yet it was not due to him. The grace of God that was with him empowered him.
I would like you to compare that passage with another. The passage above says "Not I, but the grace of God." While this next passage says in essence "Not I but Christ".
" I am crucified with Christ; and it is no longer I who live, but it is Christ who lives in me ..." (See Galatians 2:20)
This is Christ living in Paul.
" For me to live is Christ ..." (Phil. 1:21)
"When Christ our life is manifested ... " (Col. 3:4)
This is Christ laboring and working through Paul.
This is Paul living Christ.
This the work of God flowing from the indwelling Christ in Paul.
This is Paul living a mingled life incorporated with the resurrected Christ Who lives in Paul.
Paul lives and Paul works and Paul labors by FAITH in the indwelling Christ who is one with him.
" .. it is not longer I who live, but it is Christ who lives in me;
and the life which I now live in the flesh I live in faith, the faith of the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself up for me.
I do not nullify the grace of God ..." (See Gal. 2:20-21)
When you read me write about the ENJOYMENT of God, that ENJOYMENT includes the Triune God working and laboring in the Christian. First we must learn to live in the sphere and realm of Christ. Then more and more of what we do will be by the grace of Christ living one with us.
In this experience Paul said that he did not render ineffective or vain the grace of God.
"I do not nullify the grace of God ..."
Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.
Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.
Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.
Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 193 by Phat, posted 04-15-2016 10:49 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 197 by Phat, posted 04-15-2016 12:40 PM jaywill has replied

  
jaywill
Member (Idle past 2055 days)
Posts: 4519
From: VA USA
Joined: 12-05-2005


(1)
Message 196 of 1864 (782085)
04-15-2016 12:25 PM
Reply to: Message 192 by Phat
04-15-2016 10:46 AM


Re: The Great Experiential
quote:
I find it overwhelming to imagine the Creator of all seen and unseen...and of the fact that I live on a dust speck of a planet --made possible by a friendly distance Sun--among an estimated one hundred billion stars(suns)--in a galaxy among an estimated one hundred billion galaxies. That such a Creator would even acknowledge me and my whining is unfathomable. Jesus Christ makes it easier to comprehend on a one on one man on man basis. And the concept of the Holy Spirit also makes it easier to function on a day to day level secure in the belief that Gods presence and comfort (based on His love for us) is always with me.
Your sentiments are like those of the Psalmist in Psalm 8. He is dwarfed into seeming insignificance when he considers the size and majesty of the cosmos.
" When I see Your heaven, the works of Your fingers, The moon and the stars, which you have ordained,
What is mortal man, that You remember him? And the son of man that You visit him? " (Psa. 8:3,4)
But on the contrary, it is FOR man that God created the universe. And man is needed for God to fulfill His eternal purpose to dispense Himself into a living vessel to be manifested through that corporate living vessel.
This passage in Isaiah shows that the God who made the physical universe looks to humanity to be a "place" in which God can dwell as His living "house".
" Thus says Jehovah, Heaven is my throne, And the earth the footstool for My feet,
Where is then the house that you will build for Me, And where is the place of My rest? For all these things My hand has made, And all these things have come into being, declares Jehovah,
BUT ... to this kind of man will I look, to him who is poor and of a contrite spirit, and who trembles at Me word." (Isa. 66:1,2)
This kind of man is ultimately the Son of God, Jesus Christ. That is the Man mingled with God, God incarnate as a man to be our Lord and Savior.
We may be dwarfed into feeling insignificant by the heavens and the earth and all the things created by God. But God looks to be united with man. God, the Invisible One, looks to become "organically" incorporated into humanity. And this great divine enterprise begins with the creation of the universe.
And this enterprise continues with the manifestation of the Man, poor in spirit (meaning humble before the Father and not proud) vested with such glory and authority because God dwells in Him and is one with Him. This One is the prototype and the standard model of God's great enterprise - to unite with humanity that God and man may be one.
He looks to humanity for this "house". Christ is the cornerstone of this house of God.
So I want you to realize that because of this eternal plan of God He CREATED the creation. It is for this purpose He created the mind blowing universe as a stage upon which this great drama is played. That is the uniting of the invisible Divine Being with the created human being, for His expression and our enjoyment forever.
Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.
Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 192 by Phat, posted 04-15-2016 10:46 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
jaywill
Member (Idle past 2055 days)
Posts: 4519
From: VA USA
Joined: 12-05-2005


Message 198 of 1864 (782091)
04-15-2016 4:20 PM
Reply to: Message 197 by Phat
04-15-2016 12:40 PM


Re: Work It Because He Is Worth It
quote:
Just out of curiosity,, wouldn't this same grace be available to the Apostles also? After all, they met the man in person while Paul only heard the voice.
Of course the very same grace was with the twelve apostles apostles. And He as grace is with ALL the believers.
Look again. Paul does not say he ALONE labored. He only says he labored MORE. He says the same empowering was working in Peter too.
"For He who operated in Peter for the apostleship to the circumcision operated also in me for the Gentiles." (Gal. 2:8)
The same operating Holy Spirit was living and working in both "pioneers" in the Christian life. That operating One is living in every Christian. I don't mean to suggest we all have the exact same measure of labor to carry out.
Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.
Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 197 by Phat, posted 04-15-2016 12:40 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
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