A question that was first presented by Socrates.

God says woe unto him who has good for evil and evil for good.I suggest you don't have the [only good] as evil to your mind.

You know, trying to sound like Brad isn't a good idea. Just give me a straight forward answer for once.

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The Laminator
For goodness's sake, please vote Democrat this November!

God is good, every good gift comes down from heaven.I suggest that the wicked will receive the fruit of THEIR doings.God is good, and what he tells us is good because he is God and because he only is [good]. According to Christ.

mike the wiz responds to me:

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It is only a carnal mind that can say, " Even when he commits sin? ". God hasn't sinned, humans have.

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But god readily admits that he has. Why do you think he made a covenant with Noah after the flood never to flood the earth again?Because he made a mistake. He did something wrong. In fact, the entire reason that god flooded the world was because he realized he made a mistake:Genesis 6:6: And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.Why would god repent if he hadn't sinned? And it isn't like he doesn't still think to do it:Exodus 32:14: And the LORD repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people.God seemingly has the same trouble keeping on the straight and narrow path that humans do. This isn't surprising since humans are as gods, according to god.The law of god is not perfect:Hebrews 8:6: But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.8:7: For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.8:8: For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:You see: Even the Bible knows that if the covenant god made with Moses was perfect, there'd be no reason for a new one to be made with Israel.God directly states that he is the source of evil:Isaiah 45:7: I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.Now, it is not surprising to hear the Bible say this because Judaism at the time is a truly monotheistic religion: There is no such thing as the devil. All things come from god and that literally means all things.

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If god always does good, what does that mean when god changes his mind?

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Is it not lawful for God to do what he will with his own?

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That avoids my question:If god always does good, what does that mean when god changes his mind?That is, if it is good to refrain from killing, how can it also be good to kill everyone in sight?Logic, mike, use your logic. If A is good, then ~A is not good. But if god does both A and ~A how can god only do good?

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Is his eye evil, because he is good?

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God repents for the sins he had committed. After all, why would god repent if he hadn't sinned?And since all things come from god, including evil, then yes, his eye is evil...but because his eye is all things, good and evil.

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Now in my previous messages, I said that the punishment of the wicked for their evil, is justified by God's righteouss anger.

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So you admit that god does sin. That morality is relative. That god is fickle and inconstant. That the only reason why anything is "good" is because that happens to be the way god is feeling at this particular moment. There is no absolute.For someone who claims to be certain in your morality, you truly seem to be a moral relativist.

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You being not of the spirit, will have it that God is guilty, rather than men.

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When did I become an atheist? We've had this little talk before, mike. Just because I don't believe in your god doesn't mean I don't believe in any god.

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Rrhain
WWJD? JWRTFM!

sidelined writes:

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Ok but god did killing in the days before christ so the point still stands.

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God covets{thou shalt have no other gods before me}

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God commits adultery through the holy spirit upon Mary.

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Where does it end?

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Certainly not with Jesus who at times is filled with wrath (one of the Seven Deadly Sins).How else to explain why he causes a fig tree to whither for having the temerity not to be bearing fruit out of season:Matthew 21:19: And when he saw a fig tree in the way, he came to it, and found nothing thereon, but leaves only, and said unto it, Let no fruit grow on thee henceforward for ever. And presently the fig tree withered away.

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Rrhain
WWJD? JWRTFM!

mike the wiz responds to Lam...sorta...:

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God is good, every good gift comes down from heaven.

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So you're saying that a thing is good because god says it is good.Thus, there is no objective concept of good. If god says that it is good never to kill today, then it is good never to kill. But if he turns around tomorrow and says that you should go out and kill everyone you see, then that is good.Thus, killing is both good and not good, depending on the whim of an arbitrary, capricious, and fickle god.How Orwellian. If Big Brother says that 2 + 2 = 5, then it does.

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Rrhain
WWJD? JWRTFM!

Instead of quote mining, you should read Isaiah. God makes peace for a reason, as explained, and creates evil, the fruit of the wicked's doing. Infact, the OT is the law of sin and death.You quoted;" : And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart. "But did you show why God was upset and done the thing?Here's the part you missed, and the bible teaches that evil is the fruit of the wicked;Genesis 6:5 " And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that EVERY imagination of the thoughts of his heart was ONLY EVIL CONTINUALLY " - The punishment of sin is death, as I previously said (and you ignored) - God is right, yes - and the law of sin and death is to expose sin, - and also God is merciful and it sorrows him that men are so wicked.Exodus 32:7: - (Again, you have not informed us of what man was up to.) " And the LORD said unto Moses, Go, get thee down; For thy people which thou broughtest out of the land of Egypt, HAVE CORRUPTED THEMSELVES ". God only turns because Moses mentions Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob - it doesn't mean that God is not right, it means that God for Abraham's sake - remember's his covenant. Well, I agree with Christ - that only one is good [that is] God. Well, let's examone what I said and see if it correlates with the first half of this post;" Now in my previous messages, I said that the punishment of the wicked for their evil, is justified by God's righteouss anger. "No, I don't think morality is relative or that God sins or he is fickle, quite clearly man is the problem as there is always a reason for God's wrath - which is man's wickedness.God's intentions were always good, from the beginning it shows this. But human's have strived against his will. God is good, and if he repents, it's because of the evil of man. Yes, you have shown that God takes the blame for man, which also correlates with the NT - Christ, the just - taking our punishment. Did you do this unwittingly?

Now you're just being silly Rrhain, God said in the OT " Do no murder " and Christ says to love your enemy, so why would God turn back on his infinite goodness? Christ shown us what to do - and spread peaceful teachings. God only commands good - man fails all by himself.

mike the wiz responds to me:

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God said in the OT " Do no murder "

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And yet, god commits murder. Or does the deluge and the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah and the killing of Nadab and Abihu and all the rest not count?

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and Christ says to love your enemy

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And yet, Christ seethes with anger against his enemy. Or does his temper tantrum in the temple not count?

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so why would God turn back on his infinite goodness?

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Because god sins just like the rest of us. He freely admits it.Why would god need to repent anything? The entire flood is a result of god's botching a fix to his own problem. God rues the way he created humans so he decides to kill them all off...only to rue that he killed them all off. Talk about having a bad day...he can't get anything right.

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Christ shown us what to do - and spread peaceful teachings.

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Like killing a fig tree simply because it isn't bearing figs out of season? When it's the middle of winter and your peach tree isn't producing peaches, do you blame the tree?

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God only commands good

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How can that be when god changes his mind?If committing murder is evil, what is it when god does it?

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Rrhain
WWJD? JWRTFM!

If god is good, then are you saying that god is bounded by good or are you saying that god makes up his mind what is good or not?

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The Laminator
For goodness's sake, please vote Democrat this November!

When did Moses get into it? What, I need to highlight it for you? Ok, I guess:

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Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil

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God is talking about himself, therefore the "us" that we have become as one of is God himself. We are like God in the way that he specifies - the ability to know good from evil. Don't believe me, believe your god who says that we all have the same ability to know good from evil as He. And, in general, God is presumably right about those things.But in the specific case of knowledge of good and evil, it's different. We're like god in that specific ability.It really is that simple, Mike. But I guess you can't tell the difference between the specific and the general? I can talk about Hamlet's motivations, actions, nature, and desire; that doesn't mean I think Hamlet is a true story.Just because I know the god we're talking about is a fictional character doesn't mean that I can't read the book and come to conclusions about him and his nature. The Bible is there to read, by anyone who wants to. It's not like it refuses to open if you don't believe in fairy tales. I don't understand the question. Can you phrase it in an analogy that doesn't have to do with engines?

I'm not repeating the quotes again. The analogy proves you wrong, and the quote from Genesis says the man has become "as one of us" - it doesn't say equal in knowledge of good and evil. It says " to know good and evil ".Does that mean that we know as much as God, erm...Isaiah says not, and you just ignore it again and again. I'm through arguing with you. Correct, we know good and evil, but only one is good, God. I believe the bible and Christ, not you.I believe - like the bible says, that God's thoughts(500cc) are higher than ours(100cc).

What do you think that means, Mike? "As one of us"? It means "like us."It can't be any clearer. I shouldn't have to explain the meaning of statements in clear English to a reasonable person. I told you that I agreed with Isaiah - because Isaiah is speaking in the general. The Genesis author quotes God speaking on the specific.It's just that simple, Mike. But you can't tell the difference between general statements and specific ones, so you don't get it. And not God.

I believe the bible, and therefore God and Christ and Moses and Isaiah. And I admitted and agreed with God - that we know good and evil, but it doesn't say anything about the amount. It just says we became as one of them concerning this, it says NOTHING about being in equal knowledge.God knows good and evil
We know good and evilGod is the creator of the universe. We are limited humans with small brains. Yet - according to the measure, we know of good and evil, like God and his angels. It's that simple, 100cc, and 500cc.

The amount? "As one of them" means "of equal ability." If I said that I could perform on the uneven bars "as an Olympic gymnast", wouldn't you have pretty high standards for my uneven bars routine?If I said that I could race cars "as a NASCAR driver", wouldn't you think I mean that I was a pretty good driver; not simply that I knew how to drive a car?"As gods" means that we have an equal ability to determine good from evil as other gods. ...as God does. It's just that simple, Mike. Being able to drive doesn't make Jeff Gordon say "hey, that guy is like me." Being able to race alongside him does. God is clearly saying we have a commensurate knowledge of good and evil.