Does prophecy support the Bible

And if you'll recall, a major component of that thread was that the Bible is so chock-full of bad translations that it's nigh-on impossible to take it literally.As I was saying then... there are two options here:1) Attempt to read the Bible literally, as it stands in English. This is a terrible idea for Christians because, as you say, it makes it outright impossible for the Bible to be true.2) Futz around with metaphor and different translations, until you glean what meaning you can from the Bible. However, if you go this road, you will have to accept that it is your interpretation, no more or less valid than anyone else's. It is just as subject to human error as anything else, because it is a product of human reasoning and interpretive skills. In other words, "the Bible says" becomes "I think the Bible says".So before we continue, which do you want to go with? 1 or 2?[This message has been edited by Dan Carroll, 11-21-2003]

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The bible can be translated, from the language it was written in.

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Then find a copy of the new testament, in the original hebrew, and we'll work from there.Until then, we have no way of knowing the exact original words.

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Obviously in this case the word generation had multiple interpretations but when you look at the context it makes sense.

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It also makes sense with the word "generation". It would just mean that Jesus was wrong.Same context, two different meanings.

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We can take it literally. Jesus didn't think it important to explain the period of the generation.

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You'd think he would, if he wanted his prophecies to be taken seriously.Wasn't he supposed to be all-knowing? Didn't he realize that bad translations would cause his prophecy to be misunderstood, unless he clarified?

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But your right Dan we can take the words as they are written in english, and many many people see them as true.

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Are bats birds?You can think they are all you want. A literal reading would demand that you think they are. Doesn't make it so.

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Nevertheless I think your clinging on to the 'generation' argument, and ignoring our other quotes.

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You can present an unending number of quotes, and it won't matter if the translation renders them meaningless.

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Preaching to all the nations is a very good example.

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Not really. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy. Christ says, "this will be preached to all nations." Those who believe in Christ's divinity say, "come on, let's go preach to all nations, so the prophecy will be true!" And lo and behold, it is preached to all nations.[This message has been edited by Dan Carroll, 11-21-2003]

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Never before possible until international travel, TV, Radio and the internet. We are just now to the point that every nation on earth can hear the good news of the gospel.

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This doesn't even come close to addressing my point.

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Not if you take the entire passage into consideration. It should be obvious which interpretation is correct when you look at the accompanying verses.

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Why is that?Several possibilities:1) Jesus predicted correctly, but missed the mark by 2000 years.
2) Jesus was guessing, based on obvious predictions. (See Rei's posts in the other thread.) It didn't happen as fast as he thought.
3) Jesus was dead-on correct, and the rapture is nigh.You've made your interpretation clear. But it is your interpretation.

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Jesus, being all knowing, certainly would have known the bible couldn't possibly be preached to all the nations on earth before that generation passed away.

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The people of ancient Israel were not aware quite how many nations there actually were on the planet. He could easily have thought it would be possible.

It's in Leviticus 11:13-11:19. Not part of the prophecy, but a part of the Bible that cannot be taken literally with a straight face.

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Sure it does. You said it was a self fulfilling prophecy and I said it could never have been fulfilled until now.

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So it's being self-fulfilled now.Are you saying the people who are preaching across the globe now are not followers of Christ, attempting to fulfill his prophecies?

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Very true, but Jesus would have

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In your interpretation.Are you actually trying to argue "Jesus couldn't have been wrong because Jesus couldn't have been wrong"?Do I need to explain why that's circular logic?

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I doubt is Moses had a degree in science.

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I agree. He probably just made them up, and he didn't know what he was talking about.

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Now even that looks laughable, but during that day I'm sure even you would have been ridiculing Columbus.

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If he tried to tell me bats were birds, damn right I would.

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If beelzebub Dan stopped swinging his offensive flesh tool

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???I prefer to think of myself as less of a devil-type, and more of a John Constantine sorta' guy.

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Based on your knowledge now.

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Or I could have just taken note of the fact that bats don't freakin' lay eggs.

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Dan already knows my game

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Yeah... it seems to revolve mainly around the seed of my lusty confusions, and my flesh tool.I'm beginning to look at Mike kind of cock-eyed...[This message has been edited by Dan Carroll, 11-21-2003]

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It appeared that Dan had no idea what you were on about hence his '????', if it is a private joke, and I haven't got it, then I apologise.

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Not a private joke exactly... Mike will just sort of randomly start accusing me of being the devil when a thread starts to get heated. I don't take it as a slam or anything, but it is a little confusing.

More a son of Jack.And if that ain't the most obscure joke I can come up with, I dunno what is!

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No, rather he, being divine, knew and prophesied that there would be scoffers and mockers in the latter days who would refuse to acknowledge the signs of the times when the prophecies were to be fulfilled in the latter days.

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I wonder why he, being all-loving, wouldn't want to save the scoffers and mockers as well by spelling things out in plain language.

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Dan, I thought you were more intelligent than that. This's not a very brilliant argument for your Bibliophobic agenda.

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Hey, I got nothin' against Bibles. I just don't want 'em enlisting in the army, teaching my kids, or thinkin' they can get married.Bibliophobic? What the Hell does that even mean?

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Thousands of Christians have given their lives and died as martyrs in places like the jungles of Africa, New Ginineau and South America to get the gospel of Jesus to these tribes and nations. This's not a two millenial ongoing game or popularity contest for Jesus. It's a self scacrificial love agenda by those who know the resurrected Jesus is coming back and who are not selfishly looking only to save themselves, but to allow all to hear this good news and get in on the blessings of Heaven and escape the horrors of Hell.

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And bully for them. But it has fuck-all to do with whether it's a prophecy of any meaning, or whether it's a self-fulfilling prophecy.

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As I stated before the generation problem is a no brainer for serious students of the Bible. Jesus stated all these things which were to come to pass including Jerusalem again removed from the gentiles with the fig tree budding and all. It was obviously referring to the generation that sees these things which would not pass or die off.

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That's certainly one interpretation. See previous posts.Personally, I think it's silly to think that Jesus would bother making the statement in the first place if that's what it was supposed to mean. "And the people who see it will be the ones who see it. And yea, when it rains, these people will have water falling on them as if from the heavens..."

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Again, you can argue till Jesus comes about failure, but the fulfillment just keeps on marching on and the skeptic's doom draws near.

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That's nastily close to Pascal's wager, which I know you know is a fallacy, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume it's just a veiled threat on behalf of your god.