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Author | Topic: There you Go,YECs...biblical "evidence" of "flat earth beliefs" | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Mister Pamboli Member (Idle past 7607 days) Posts: 634 From: Washington, USA Joined: |
I thought this thread was a joke at first. Apparently not! Oh well, here goes...
quote: I think you'll find the 12th to 16th century comprise what historians often refer to as the High, Late and Post-Medieval periods. The dark ages are much earlier, roughly from the fall of the Roman empire to the start of the Carolingian period. Oh and they were a European period - the Bible is Middle Eastern in origin, and they were having a jolly enlightened time while Europeans were "in the dark."Still, I'm sure the rest of your historical analysis is right. Let's see ... [b] [QUOTE]Most of the ancient textament was writen 300 BC and the new testament was writen a mere few century after the death of christ. The many parts of the Bible were ASSEMBLED in the middle ages and TRANSLATED from the hebrew and greek to latin and then english[/b][/QUOTE] 300 BC was busy year for someone! The Bible was assembled in the Middle Ages? This must have been awkward for Bishop Ulfilas of the Goths who translated the Old and New Testaments in the 4th century, or Mesrob who completed his Armenian translation in the first decade of the 5th century.
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LudvanB Inactive Member |
quote: Mr Pamboli. I thank you for correcting some of my historical innacuracies,although i would say that most historians would readily consider the spanish inquisition as the dark ages. I was apparantly given some bad info on when the Bible was actually writen...You did not,however,adress my initial post itself i noticed. I was not joking when i QUOTED DIRECTLY FROM THE BIBLE that the earth is described as a FLAT,IMMOBILE WORLD. Would you care to comment on that?
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Mister Pamboli Member (Idle past 7607 days) Posts: 634 From: Washington, USA Joined: |
quote: I think you are confusing a casual sense of "dark ages" meaning "evil times" with the historical "Dark Ages" which was a term much used for historians for the period between the end of the Roman Empire (when learning, government and the rule of law were pretty much the norm) and the revival of learning under Charlemagne.[b] [QUOTE]I was apparantly given some bad info on when the Bible was actually writen...You did not,however,adress my initial post itself i noticed. I was not joking when i QUOTED DIRECTLY FROM THE BIBLE that the earth is described as a FLAT,IMMOBILE WORLD. Would you care to comment on that?[/b][/QUOTE] You should read some material on the development of the Bible: it is particularly useful for demolishing fundamentalist views. Here's a good link to get started, which is full of historical detail, if a little dogmatic: http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/03274a.htmThe reason I didn't respond to your original quotes is because I don't think it is a good idea to confront fundamentalism with apparent contradictions in detail - it is playing their game. Better to confront why fundamentalism is untenable in principle, rather than mistaken in trifling details. Nice try, though! [This message has been edited by Mister Pamboli, 02-27-2002]
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LudvanB Inactive Member |
And i firmly believe that confronting fundamentalism can only be done be constantly demonstrating how silly it is by showing exemples of what they recognize as fundamental truths as complete nonsense.
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Brad McFall Member (Idle past 5063 days) Posts: 3428 From: Ithaca,NY, USA Joined: |
but do seeds fall to this flat earth fall to the sun on purpose or do seeds fall to a moving Earth (to Sun? Moon? Asteriod? Earth? etc??) By projecting the Copernican question to matter from mind Freud is removed from history. Wa LA. (since earth falls to sun seeds can fall to sun by falling under gravity provided they are adapted to do this.)
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John Paul Inactive Member |
quote: John Paul:Enough of this nonsense. From page 97-98 of Refuting Evolution: quote: ------------------John Paul
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LudvanB Inactive Member |
Yes but Neil Amrstrong could see the earth rotate on its axis and would never conclude that the earth was anything but a Sphere...Khud means circle,not spherity. And this does not in any way adress the quotations i linked to,which not only describe the earth as something that can be observed from a montain top in its entirety but as something that is completely IMMOBILE,thus,NOT rotating on its Axis.
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joz Inactive Member |
Interesting I recently saw something to the effect that the hebrew for sphere was derived from the babylonian for skull.... It began with a g and definately wasn`t "khug" which is circle......
I`ll have to try and find it....
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doctrbill Member (Idle past 2795 days) Posts: 1174 From: Eugene, Oregon, USA Joined: |
quote: That was by me. There are two words - "gulgoleth", which is translated as head or skull, and "gullah", which is translated as pommel or bowl. (a pommel is the knob on the handle of a sword) These are derived from the Babylonian gulgulla. They used this word to describe a style of water jug. ------------db
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RetroCrono Inactive Member |
quote: You completely missed the point I was making. Sorry for not explaining it clear enough. But here goes, I'll try again. Basically, if the earth was the center of the universe than both the sun and the moon would rotate seperately around the earth (the center). Right? However, they didn't just say the sun stood still, the moon stopped at the same time. Which leads me to believe that the sun and the moon didn't stop, but the other way around, the earth stoppped. Or better still, slowed down to half of its pace to turn one day into two days. Get what I mean? What your claiming doesn't fit with what's written (or from what I can understand). If this is just a myth like I'm sure your supposing. Than why the heck did they say the moon stopped too? The whole point was to say that one day went for two days, or daylight for two days. If they believed the earth was the center of the universe and everything rotated around it, wouldn't they just have said the sun stayed still, to signify the light source remained? Can you say they got it right when describing such an event (myth or not) from an observational stand point. Regards,RC
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gene90 Member (Idle past 3853 days) Posts: 1610 Joined: |
RC,
If they believed in a heliocentric model, don't you think they would say that the Earth stopped moving, rather than saying that both the Sun and Moon stopped? Also don't you think the Sun and Moon both stopping would be as likely to be a poetic device rather than an observation? Do you feel the passage would have the same effect as, "The Sun stopped but the Moon kept moving..."
[QUOTE][b]If they believed the earwh was the center of the universe and everything rotated around it, wouldn't they just have said the sun stayed still, to signify the light source remained?[/QUOTE] [/b] But they view the Moon as a second light source. Also the passage distinctly states that the Sun and Moon stood still, not the Earth. [This message has been edited by gene90, 02-28-2002]
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Peter Member (Idle past 1509 days) Posts: 2161 From: Cambridgeshire, UK. Joined: |
quote: Does anyone read here or do they just skim ? This started because LudvanB mis-read or mis-understood a commentthat I made that:: The idea of a flat earth arose during the dark ages (or possiblya medieval era), and that PRIOR to that, during the time the bible was written, people knew that the earth was NOT FLAT!!!
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doctrbill Member (Idle past 2795 days) Posts: 1174 From: Eugene, Oregon, USA Joined: |
quote: The Jerusalem Bible, Reader's Edition, contains this footnote for Joshua 10:13 -"Lines from a popular song, appealing for time to secure victory, are here adapted to the author's purpose." Another example of such poetic fancy may be found at Isaiah 24:19, 23."The earth is utterly broken down, the earth is clean dissolved ... it shall fall, and not rise again. ... the moon shall be confounded and the sun ashamed ..." The passage in Joshua reminds me of a 1950's Sci. Fi. movie titled:"The Day the Earth Stood Still". [ i.e. Ordinary life came to a halt.]
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LudvanB Inactive Member |
quote: If the hebrew who originaly authored the Bible KNEW that the earth was a huge ball of dirt hurtling through space at a wopping 29.8 km/s,they certainly did not make this knowledge self evident in their writings. Only on a small flat earth could there be a mountain that would allow one to see the WHOLE WORLD. And when they say the earth cannot be moved,i dont see how else this can be interpreted with any level of credibility
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doctrbill Member (Idle past 2795 days) Posts: 1174 From: Eugene, Oregon, USA Joined: |
quote: The idea of a spherical earth was endorsed by Aristotle circa 300 BC. The Flat Earth concept goes back to the earliest writings of the Sumerian sages, circa 2500 BC. ------------------Bachelor of Arts - Loma Linda University Major - Biology; Minor - Religion Anatomy and Physiology - LLU School of Medicine Embryology - La Sierra University Biblical languages - Pacific Union College Bible doctrines - Walla Walla College
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