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Author | Topic: Racist? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Taz Member (Idle past 3321 days) Posts: 5069 From: Zerus Joined: |
I've been keeping track of this story since fox news and conservative activists decided to lie right through their teeth just a few days ago. We're talking about the ultimate quote mining. They posted a video of her speech taken completely out of context. The whole video revealed the opposite of what they said about her supposed racism.
Again, let me repeat myself. This is the 21st century. Racism has fallen out of fashion. Nobody, not even the kkk, will admit being racist. You have to look at their actions and interpret. They lied right through their teeth on national television to condemn a noble social worker. And the scary part is their own bible forbids such an act. And shame on the other side for acting blindly to conservative propaganda.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 314 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
The whole video revealed the opposite of what they said about her supposed racism. Well of course when they said she was a "racist" they meant that she was "a conservative winning an argument with a liberal". Don't you ever read right-wing bumper stickers?
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riVeRraT Member (Idle past 445 days) Posts: 5788 From: NY USA Joined:
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"Theodoric" writes: No. A person you perceive as a liberal called the cops on you. Your statement that liberals call the cops for what you perceive as something stupid is in itself a bigotted statement. How can you tell whether I perceive someone is liberal, or know for a fact that someone is liberal. You are just full of shit.
I am reacting to the evidence you have presented. We all have prejudices, to claim otherwise is lying. Maybe lying to yourself but it is lying. I am willing to admit I have prejudices and can be a bigot at times. But the funny thing is, by you pushing that off on me does not make you any more or less. Pointing out what I am or my flaws does not remove it from you. Myabe you should critically think about the things you are saying to see how people could reach the conclusion you are a bigot. Unless of course self examonation is not something you feel is necessary, being prejudice free and all that as you are. Yea of course, no one is perfect. But I could say all that about you too. My point is that for the most part, I am not prejudice, and is it not hard to be that way. I believe it is the right way to be. When they apologized to Shirley Sherrod, and we found out that she wasn't racist, I got a chill, and I got happy in side. I don't blame them for mis-reporting it right either, because if you watch the speech, she sounds like she is being prejudice. She also makes many bigoted, and prejudice statements in her speech. Like "one of his own" or differentiating between a black farmer and a white one. What's the difference, they are farmers! If I had said those things, I would not have been let off as easy as her.
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riVeRraT Member (Idle past 445 days) Posts: 5788 From: NY USA Joined: |
"nwr" writes: I would guess that there is lots of racism in NY. There certainly was when I was living in that region (in CT). For sure, there is still a lot of racism in Chicago. The amount of racism has been diminishing over time, but there is still a lot of it around. Of course there is a lot of racism, there is a lot of people! But I think on a percentage value, it is less here than in other parts of the country. One thing I noticed, is that certain areas on NYC are more prone to racism than others. I worked in and around all the different communities in NYC. I found in Harlem, the black people there were very racist towards me, as apposed to Kings County Brooklyn, or the Bronx. They don't even hold the door for you if you are white person in Harlem. My wife who is Puerto Rican, works for the same corporation, and had to go to the same places I worked, and she even got the same treatment from them. I worked with black people (as a partner) who were so racist, that if we were putting a white register in the ceiling, he would question why it was white and not black. Drove me freakin crazy. Everyone one of his sentences began with either "well the white man says", or "well the black man says". After two weeks of gracefully listening to his asinine statements I yelled at him and told him I don't see colors, and none of my relatives are prejudice, or ever owned a slave so stfu. What I seen was that Black people in those areas have a lot of hatred against white people, and use racism as an excuse to not advance in life. Al Sharpton finally said something useful when Obama got elected, "now the black man has no excuse, if America can have a black president". He accused (certain) black people of the very thing I saw, being lazy. Of course all this can be said about white people too. On my job when I worked for the city, I was an advocate against racism. The more bigoted and prejudice white people did not like me for that, as I would speak out against them, and their actions in front of everyone. I've been patted on the back many times for doing that. Real racism actually pisses me off. It's a huge barrier that keeps people apart.
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riVeRraT Member (Idle past 445 days) Posts: 5788 From: NY USA Joined: |
"ramoss" writes: She also is blond hair , blue eyed and very very white looking. It's not a matter of skin color, It is a matter of attitude. Well of course, black men love white women. j/k.My remark was a sarcastic one.
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riVeRraT Member (Idle past 445 days) Posts: 5788 From: NY USA Joined: |
"Ringo" writes: It doesn't really matter who you're racist "towards" and I don't think you have to be "raised racist" to be racist. It's a natural human tendency to categorize others by obvious characteristics. What I'm saying is that you'd be better off being aware of your natural tendencies and trying to civilize them instead of just denying them. Yes, good statement, but one can argue that your natural tendencies come from how you were raised. If you grew up around white people exclusively, and was never taught a thing about racism (good or bad), the first time you see a black person, you may not act correctly, like the first time you ever see anything you are not accustomed to. That would be your natural tendency. But if you grew up in a mixed area (like me) where for the most part everyone got along, your natural tendency would be to get along with people regardless of color.
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Artemis Entreri  Suspended Member (Idle past 4258 days) Posts: 1194 From: Northern Virginia Joined: |
riverat writes:
Roflmao
Yea, he fondled my money, lol.
onifre writes: My point was that, while I avoid those areas, I don't care that they exist. I don't care that there are areas with a majority of black residents, however you seem to care.
I find it interesting that they exist, and I would prefer they do not exist in my backyard, which is why I choose not to live in these places any longer. I seem to care? are you reading into what I am saying again? I couldn’t care less, this is all for debate. These boards would not be half as fun if everyone agreed, I am just playing the heel.
onifre writes:
Now that’s just discriminatory against poor people; you poor-personist [SARCASM]. Now, if you said, we should try to not have poor areas and help bring up neighborhoods suffering from it, then that would be cool. You're not signalling out any one specific race. I would feel just as threatened in a white trash trailer park, or in a mexican barrio. Poverty breeds criminals, race has nothing to do with it.
I am not really into this Marxist line of reasoning that classes in society are the causes for things, especially crime. In my opinion some of the wealthiest heads of state (let me take Muammar al-Gaddafi since we were talking about Libya earlier, or maybe even Fidel Castro) are extremely criminal. Crime is not a class issue for me, and I can keep naming wealthy heads of state, that are probably more criminal than the citizens of that state, so I doubt wealth or lack there-of is the root. Besides In my comparison and data I was trying to show Dangerous places, based on violent crimes, and not crimes in general, as I am sure poor people steal across the globe, though stealing is not a crime that fits into the dangerous crime index.
onifre writes:
I didn’t mean you. You are one of the few people on here who keep it real, and are objective and honest, or at least I believe that you are (I could be wrong). I think you would more than likely have a good discussion rather than just call names and be a talking head.
You called us bigots for pointing out that you were sounding a bit racist in your comments.
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9201 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.2 |
How can you tell whether I perceive someone is liberal, or know for a fact that someone is liberal. You are just full of shit. Do I have to go to the beginning? You are the one that stated raging liberals needlessly call the cops. You are the one that makes the claim.
Message 187rat writes: Maybe I am racist against all radicals? Raging liberals? Especially ones that call the cops every time you fart. Message 199Theodoric writes: WTF?Liberals call the cops more? Any evidence for this bit of weirdness? Message 209rat writes: Yes, in my situation. That wasn't a blanket statement. Message 212Theodoric writes: No. A person you perceive as a liberal called the cops on you. Your statement that liberals call the cops for what you perceive as something stupid is in itself a bigotted statement. Message 228rat writes: How can you tell whether I perceive someone is liberal, or know for a fact that someone is liberal. You are just full of shit. I don't blame them for mis-reporting it right either, because if you watch the speech, she sounds like she is being prejudice. She also makes many bigoted, and prejudice statements in her speech. Like "one of his own" or differentiating between a black farmer and a white one. What's the difference, they are farmers! If I had said those things, I would not have been let off as easy as her. There was no reporting on the speech. It was reporting on a doctored version of the speech. A version doctored for a racist, conservative agenda. Did you watch the whole speech? It isn't about race is about class. It is a story about a person realizing her own prejudices and rising above them. You might want to try understanding it. Facts don\'t lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
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Artemis Entreri  Suspended Member (Idle past 4258 days) Posts: 1194 From: Northern Virginia Joined: |
Dr Adequate writes: Well, this is hardly a secret. The map below shows the intention homicide rate per 100,000 (darker blue is higher; gray means figures are not available). Wow, I appreciate the engagement on this and as a professional cartographer I appreciate the attempt to use a map, though I wish there was a link to the place the map came from, or that the map had a legend outside of your own in parenthesis. I am not really sure why you chose a Choropleth map to illustrate your point though. It is really the wrong method in mapping. Choropleth maps are thematic maps designed to show the pattern of the statistical variable that is shown on the map. Now this can be properly accomplished with the data that you have, but on a world map it does not make any sense. As the map you use is clearly an example of the Modifiable areal unit problem Modifiable areal unit problem - Wikipedia. This is very common place in use of Choropleth maps, and Russia is almost a textbook example. Russia has the majority of its population along its western side (near/in Europe), while the majority of the land is sparsely inhabited. It is inappropriate to show the whole of Russia in a Choropleth map where the data is based on per 100,000 people because there are vast portions of Russia that are basically uninhabited. And then to compare it to Barbados, which is a mere 5 pixels on the map (and the same color, thus illustrating the same rate), yet telling me on the side that the numbers are off just does not make much sense to me. Also you chose to compare a region with one of the lowest population densities (Russia), to one with a high population density (Barbados). There is more than one reason why I limited the scope of my area to North America instead of the whole world, but this is a good example of one of them. Also this data focuses on murder only, where my data was on an index of multiple crimes (Murder, Rape, Assault, Battery, etc.). Once again I appreciate it and I think you are getting close, but it is hard to see your point in this post.
Dr Adequate writes: You're twice as likely to get murdered in Russia (B% 0.05%) than Barbados (B% 90%).
Once again I do not see it. In the map you gave, Barbados and Russia are the same color, which would lead one to believe otherwise. And since you gave only a map but no links it s hard to deduce much from it.
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nwr Member Posts: 6412 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: Member Rating: 4.5
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Artemis Entreri writes:
If I click on the "peek" button of Message 219 (the post by Dr Adequate, I see that the map came fromWow, I appreciate the engagement on this and as a professional cartographer I appreciate the attempt to use a map, though I wish there was a link to the place the map came from, or that the map had a legend outside of your own in parenthesis. "http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/4/4a/Homicide-world2.png/800px-Homicide-world2.png" It is probably referenced by an article in Wikipedia. (Just posting this to give you some hints on digging out information).
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 314 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
I am not really sure why you chose a Choropleth map to illustrate your point though. Because it was there.
It is inappropriate to show the whole of Russia in a Choropleth map where the data is based on per 100,000 people because there are vast portions of Russia that are basically uninhabited. And your statistics about American cities didn't break it down street by street. So? We were asked for data about countries.
Also this data focuses on murder only, where my data was on an index of multiple crimes (Murder, Rape, Assault, Battery, etc.). Again, it's what I could find with a quick look round.
Once again I do not see it. In the map you gave, Barbados and Russia are the same color ... Yeah, blue. But they're not the same shade of blue. Barbados is actually the same shade as the USA (I just copied the map into MS Paint and checked). I based my assertion on looking up the figures for Russia and Barbados directly, rather than reading them off the map. Russia, 14.9/100,000; Barbados, 7.49/100,000. That's not the only reason I'd rather be in Barbados.
And since you gave only a map but no links it s hard to deduce much from it. Have some figures.
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Artemis Entreri  Suspended Member (Idle past 4258 days) Posts: 1194 From: Northern Virginia Joined: |
DevilsAdvocate writes:
Well since you asked, I made a very broad and quick map (took me about 10min).
It depends on what you consider "white people". That is like saying Japanese are "white people". Most people and governmental institutions associate Caucasians as "white people". People of Jewish descent are of semetic decent not caucasian. Of course I hate all the grouping by race thing in the first place. But I am just stating what is common practice.
BTW the majority of Jews today may speak a Semitic Language (Hebrew), but are ethnically German and Eastern Europeans. They are called Ashkenazi, and they make up a vast majority of the Jewish population of the world today. And are white. Perhaps you have heard of the Ashkenazi language: Yiddish. While written in the Hebrew alphabet, its is composed of Hebrew, Aramaic (both Semitic languages), Slavic, German, and Romance languages (Indo-European languages). Maybe you would rather read this from another source, perhaps a peer reviewed one: Ashkenazi Jews - Wikipedia It is incorrect to refer to Jews as anything but white, and your silly comparison to calling Japanese white, is little more than the silly comparisons you make in almost every post. I don’t know what your generalization about Caucasians is about, so I Wikipedia that word as well. And interestingly enough it agree with me. Here is a photo from the page about Caucasians, showing the variety of them.
File:Europaeid types.jpg - Wikipedia If you notice the 7th picture is of the Bedouin Morph (Arabids) Since Both Arabs and Hebrews are Semitic People, I am going to have to agree, as I have anyway, that whether Jews are Semitic or European, they are have always been Caucasian (WHITE). You want to talk evidence, I’ll talk evidence, and the evidence says you have no idea what you are talking about when it come to Jews.
DevilsAvocate writes: Huh? What are you talking about? What anti-white people are you talking about? Was this more of your racial Freudian slips?
You said I was an Anti-Semitic. White Supremacist. And since I have all the evidence that clearly states that Semitic peoples are white, you claimed I was Anti-White (Semitic), White Supremacist. Which like most of your ideas, makes little sense. Got any quotable evidence or is it all just generalizations about what people say ? Edited by Artemis Entreri, : bad with url links, but getting better
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
DR A writes: AE writes: It is inappropriate to show the whole of Russia in a Choropleth map where the data is based on per 100,000 people because there are vast portions of Russia that are basically uninhabited. And your statistics about American cities didn't break it down street by street. So? We were asked for data about countries. Too funny. Does he realize that in statistics based on incidents per number of people , density or area is totally irrelevant? Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
riVeRraT writes:
But "getting along with people" isn't the opposite of racism. The racists' theme song is, "Some of my best friends are black." A racist puts up with people in spite of their colour. His attitude is that there are a few good black people (his friends) but in general, "they" are not to be trusted. But if you grew up in a mixed area (like me) where for the most part everyone got along, your natural tendency would be to get along with people regardless of color. I'm just saying that it's better to be aware of your own attitudes and to look for your own negative attitudes instead of just denying that you have any. I rode off into the sunset, went all the way around the world and now I\'m back where I started.
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1496 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
80% of what is reported is flawed, from everyone. I'm sure any minute now you're going to post the evidence of that? I won't hold my breath.
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