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Author | Topic: Oh No, The New Awesome Primary Thread | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Omnivorous Member Posts: 3991 From: Adirondackia Joined: Member Rating: 6.9
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Some news reports in the past week have described people stopping by with supplies and more guns. The reinforcing militia men were told their help wasn't needed.
There does not yet appear to be a cordon sanitaire."If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads." Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto.-Terence
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 314 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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Here's an article written by an Oregon rancher. No, it does not explain why a bunch of loons from Nevada should go to Oregon against the wishes of the locals to take up arms against America and seize a bird sanctuary in support of correctly-convicted arsonists, so it's not really something "on the Bundy side". But it does show that ranchers have some grievances that are more legitimate than that.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/...d-about-the-bundy-standoff
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JonF Member (Idle past 197 days) Posts: 6174 Joined: |
Law enforcement is trying a hands-off policy. Way off. The Bundy Bunch come and go.
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Omnivorous Member Posts: 3991 From: Adirondackia Joined: Member Rating: 6.9
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ThinkProgress offers the most detailed examination of the conflict's recent and historical roots that I've seen. The area is ripe for conflict in part because it is so poorly suited to ranching.
How The Bundy Standoff Could Screw Over Ranchers Of particular interest, they note that stakeholders in and around the refuge had reached a sort of detent prior to the occupation:
quote: Also, the Hammonds, the cause celebre of the occupiers, were water thieves before they were arsonists."If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads." Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto.-Terence
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Tanypteryx Member Posts: 4451 From: Oregon, USA Joined: Member Rating: 5.0
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But it does show that ranchers have some grievances that are more legitimate than that. https://www.washingtonpost.com/...d-about-the-bundy-standoff That is an interesting article. Ranching is definitely on of the riskier business to be in and it would not be possible in many cases without the government subsidizing it. When I follow the link in this sentence "The siege on our industry has only increased under the Obama administration. Officials are effectively regulating us out of business by enforcing a string of unprecedented environmental restrictions." I did not find a single regulation listed. Instead, I found a list of grievances about the federal government ignoring laws passed by states ordering the Federal government to hand over all federal land to the state. So basically they are all pissed that they couldn't use conservative controlled state government to confiscate U.S. public land. This was the only link I followed in his article but I think it pretty much shows this rancher's agenda. It is ok to have an agenda but don't give us a sob story about how tough it is to be a rancher and then ask for free stuff at the expense of the rest of us. This guy's dream was to become a rancher. These are the same guys who are pissed about hungry children getting food stamps.What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy
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Tanypteryx Member Posts: 4451 From: Oregon, USA Joined: Member Rating: 5.0
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Also, the Hammonds, the cause celebre of the occupiers, were water thieves before they were arsonists. Plus, they illegally grazed on public land where no grazing was allowed. This happened numerous times at Page Springs campground, damaging sensitive habitat. It is really amazing how much damage a herd of cows can do to springs, streams and riparian zones. Sometimes it takes generations to recover and then only if effort is made to restore it and the cattle are kept out.What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy
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Omnivorous Member Posts: 3991 From: Adirondackia Joined: Member Rating: 6.9
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Tanypteryx writes: It is really amazing how much damage a herd of cows can do to springs, streams and riparian zones. Sometimes it takes generations to recover and then only if effort is made to restore it and the cattle are kept out. There is something in the hearts of some of the folks who think all environmentalists are radicals that yearns to desecrate the natural world in order to wound their political opponents. This occurred to me some years ago when I read a news report of a man who paddled a small boat to an island off the west coast with the express purpose of girdling an ancient, well-loved tree. It wasn't in the way of any development or industry, as I recall--he simply wanted to kill it because of what it meant to others. Since then, I've seen and heard this wanton impulse in many guises, from Congress to conversation, all frighteningly ugly, more akin to war-time raping and pillaging than a political dispute with fellow citizens."If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads." Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto.-Terence
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Tanypteryx Member Posts: 4451 From: Oregon, USA Joined: Member Rating: 5.0
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There is something in the hearts of some of the folks who think all environmentalists are radicals that yearns to desecrate the natural world in order to wound their political opponents. I am always puzzled by them. It is as if they cannot see any beauty in the world and feel the need destroy or dominate nature as affirmation of the superiority of their species. I am slowly becoming convinced that there may be 2 species of humans on this planet.What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy
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jar Member (Idle past 423 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined:
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Like Donald Trump?
quote: What rational person could ever vote for such a vile person?Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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Omnivorous Member Posts: 3991 From: Adirondackia Joined: Member Rating: 6.9
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Tanypteryx writes: I am slowly becoming convinced that there may be 2 species of humans on this planet. As a young sci-fi fan, I used to fantasize that I was an alien orphan: if I thought hard enough, they'd come back for me. My favorite visualization was a tractor beam lifting me right out of my 4th grade seat and through the windows of Daniel Webster Elementary, to the consternation of Miss Morton The Terrible. Eventually, I decided I was a native, but lots of other people..."If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads." Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto.-Terence
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 314 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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Does anyone else find this is getting like a Gilbert and Sullivan opera\comedy? I am the very model of a modern mad militiaman:if ducks should be defeated then I'm sure that my militia can; when mallards take your freedoms we'll be there to save your liberties we'd hang 'em in a gibbet if we knew just what a gibbet is; if pochards cause you problems then I've got the right solution; I'll dispatch a private army and I'll claim it's constitutional; equipped with proper weaponry you'll see how very well I can defend this free republic when it's threatened by a pelican. Confronting grebes is something that I've surely got your backing onso kindly send us Cheez-its and Doritos to be snacking on; you'll sleep much sounder knowing that in us the People have a set of patriotic heroes who'll defend you from an avocet. We'll stand up to a gosling, all my brave militiamen agree, and run like hell if ever we should meet an actual enemy: I'd lead my legions backwards quick as ever a militia ran; I am the very model of a modern mad militiaman.
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Tanypteryx Member Posts: 4451 From: Oregon, USA Joined: Member Rating: 5.0
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Like Donald Trump?
quote: What rational person could ever vote for such a vile person? I can guarantee that no rational person will vote for him.What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy
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Omnivorous Member Posts: 3991 From: Adirondackia Joined: Member Rating: 6.9
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quote: Couldn't resist--intended as applause."If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads." Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto.-Terence
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Tanypteryx Member Posts: 4451 From: Oregon, USA Joined: Member Rating: 5.0 |
There are increasingly strident calls for the disarming and arrest of these criminals, coming from individuals and many organizations that are involved with, or support Malheur National Wildlife Refuge.
I have visited Malheur a couple hundred time in my life. Most of the very best time I spent with my father was at Malheur.
Oregon Judge Plans to Bill the Bundy Militia $70,000 a Day to Cover County Security CostsWhat if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy
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Omnivorous Member Posts: 3991 From: Adirondackia Joined: Member Rating: 6.9
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I've been wondering, since these are public lands, does a private citizen have legal standing to litigate againt the Bundy Bunch?
Or how about litigation to press the Federal government on the issue? I know the SCOTUS only really likes the Equal Protection Clause when protecting Republican presidential candidates, but still. Senior Bundy (right turn, Clive) continues to graze his cattle without paying the rent, threatens to shoot anyone who trespasses on "his" land, and he and his militia compatriots remain untouched after an armed insurrection and threatening of Federal agents. That first "hands-off Bundys" policy was a dangerous mistake."If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads." Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto.-Terence
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