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Author Topic:   Oh No, The New Awesome Primary Thread
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 781 of 1639 (778399)
02-19-2016 6:01 PM
Reply to: Message 777 by Faith
02-19-2016 5:41 PM


Re: Trump On Torture
So what has happened is that the propaganda machine has corrupted enough people to turn the standards of millennia upside down
So you don't really care about the vote of the majority after all. That's fine with me. I was never in favor of allowing a majority to vote away a minorities rights in the first place. But now I wonder if you actually have an argument.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 777 by Faith, posted 02-19-2016 5:41 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 792 by Faith, posted 02-19-2016 11:54 PM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 782 of 1639 (778400)
02-19-2016 6:06 PM
Reply to: Message 760 by Faith
02-19-2016 4:07 PM


Re: Trump On Torture
If torture doesn't work then don't do it. But stop vilifying people who may be of a different opinion even about that.
I'm not going to cease from expressing my opinion. And I notice you doing a lot of vilification here in this thread.
Do you even have an opinion about whether waterboarding works? Aren't you just saying we should trust Trump even though the actual evidence that it does not work? Nope. Not going to do that.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 760 by Faith, posted 02-19-2016 4:07 PM Faith has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 783 of 1639 (778401)
02-19-2016 6:10 PM
Reply to: Message 751 by Faith
02-19-2016 2:35 PM


Re: Trump On Torture
Hoooeee, there's a PC rant for you. Oh yeah, should add "xenophobic" and "homophobic" to the list of PC emotion-provoking personal attacks, Lessee, hate, racist, liar, xenophobic, homophobic. What form of personal attack have I left out.
If the shoe fits, wear it. Nothing PC about calling a generalized hate statement xenophobic. I'm certainly not going to allow you to shorten the dictionary.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 751 by Faith, posted 02-19-2016 2:35 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 791 by Faith, posted 02-19-2016 11:47 PM NoNukes has not replied

  
ooh-child
Member (Idle past 373 days)
Posts: 242
Joined: 04-10-2009


(1)
Message 784 of 1639 (778402)
02-19-2016 6:11 PM
Reply to: Message 774 by Faith
02-19-2016 5:38 PM


Re: immigration and incarceration
Good thing you're not a lawyer. Sad that you're so wrapped up in your own righteousness you can't listen to reason.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 774 by Faith, posted 02-19-2016 5:38 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 786 by NoNukes, posted 02-19-2016 6:17 PM ooh-child has seen this message but not replied
 Message 790 by Faith, posted 02-19-2016 11:46 PM ooh-child has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 785 of 1639 (778403)
02-19-2016 6:13 PM
Reply to: Message 751 by Faith
02-19-2016 2:35 PM


Re: Trump On Torture
Yeah, thanks to the silencing of the people by PC it is now illegal for the people to have an opinion about gay marriage.
I don't really care about your opinion on gay marriage. What I asked you was whether you would follow the law on the subject. If not, then your posturing about 'illegal' activity justifying any manner of speech would seem to be wrong.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 751 by Faith, posted 02-19-2016 2:35 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 789 by Faith, posted 02-19-2016 11:45 PM NoNukes has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(3)
Message 786 of 1639 (778404)
02-19-2016 6:17 PM
Reply to: Message 784 by ooh-child
02-19-2016 6:11 PM


Re: immigration and incarceration
Sad that you're so wrapped up in your own righteousness you can't listen to reason.
Unfortunately, that sometimes happens to lawyers too. I've sat in conferences with a client and watched every lawyer in the room group think themselves into thinking they are going to win a case only to be devastated by the verdict. I've drunk the Kool Aid on some occasions myself.
Introspection is a difficult, but essential life skill. I'm still learning.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 784 by ooh-child, posted 02-19-2016 6:11 PM ooh-child has seen this message but not replied

  
Genomicus
Member (Idle past 1971 days)
Posts: 852
Joined: 02-15-2012


(9)
Message 787 of 1639 (778405)
02-19-2016 7:15 PM
Reply to: Message 774 by Faith
02-19-2016 5:38 PM


Re: immigration and incarceration
Oh aren't you just the last word in precision. Civil offense, criminal offense, it's an OFFENSE for pete's sake. It's AGAINST THE LAW.
There's a significant difference between criminal offenses and civil offenses. Which is why it's at once worrisome and problematic when people (primarily angry Anglo GOP supporters) refer to undocumented immigrants as "criminals." A rapist is a criminal. Being brought across the southern border to the U.S. at 3 years old by one's parents, attending high school, and graduating in the top of the class is not the mark of criminal behavior.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 774 by Faith, posted 02-19-2016 5:38 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 788 by Faith, posted 02-19-2016 11:43 PM Genomicus has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 788 of 1639 (778414)
02-19-2016 11:43 PM
Reply to: Message 787 by Genomicus
02-19-2016 7:15 PM


Re: immigration and incarceration
There's a significant difference between criminal offenses and civil offenses. Which is why it's at once worrisome and problematic when people (primarily angry Anglo GOP supporters) refer to undocumented immigrants as "criminals." A rapist is a criminal. Being brought across the southern border to the U.S. at 3 years old by one's parents, attending high school, and graduating in the top of the class is not the mark of criminal behavior.
The real offense is to refer to illegal immigrants as "undocumented" which pretends they are in some sense legal, which is a PC lie that has been picked up by the media and shoved down our throats along with all the rest of the PC program to undermine the nation.
The difference in the terms doesn't mean a lot to me. Illegal is illegal.
Hey I'm happy there are success stories like that and I'm all for doing something for them somehow or other, but illegal entry into the country is illegal no matter how you spin it, and declaring illegality legal is mind rape.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 787 by Genomicus, posted 02-19-2016 7:15 PM Genomicus has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 794 by Genomicus, posted 02-20-2016 12:13 AM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 789 of 1639 (778415)
02-19-2016 11:45 PM
Reply to: Message 785 by NoNukes
02-19-2016 6:13 PM


Re: Trump On Torture
You know the answer to your question. The law violates God's word, so wherever it puts a person in the position of choosing to obey the law or obey God's word Christians are going to obey God's word. That's that.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 785 by NoNukes, posted 02-19-2016 6:13 PM NoNukes has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 805 by Hyroglyphx, posted 02-20-2016 12:59 AM Faith has replied
 Message 809 by JonF, posted 02-20-2016 7:35 AM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 790 of 1639 (778416)
02-19-2016 11:46 PM
Reply to: Message 784 by ooh-child
02-19-2016 6:11 PM


Re: immigration and incarceration
I see. So now "reason" justifies illegality. Wonderful. How very PC.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 784 by ooh-child, posted 02-19-2016 6:11 PM ooh-child has seen this message but not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 791 of 1639 (778417)
02-19-2016 11:47 PM
Reply to: Message 783 by NoNukes
02-19-2016 6:10 PM


Re: Trump On Torture
But the dictionary you love is the PC dictionary. Some Christian you are who prefers PC ad hominems to arguing the facts.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 783 by NoNukes, posted 02-19-2016 6:10 PM NoNukes has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 792 of 1639 (778418)
02-19-2016 11:54 PM
Reply to: Message 781 by NoNukes
02-19-2016 6:01 PM


gay marriage travesty
The fact is I don't believe a majority is for gay marriage. The vote is bogus. However, Christians will not obey such an evil law, however it was manufactured, where it requires a choice between it and the Bible.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 781 by NoNukes, posted 02-19-2016 6:01 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 796 by NoNukes, posted 02-20-2016 12:36 AM Faith has replied
 Message 810 by JonF, posted 02-20-2016 7:38 AM Faith has not replied
 Message 813 by Dr Adequate, posted 02-20-2016 9:17 AM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 793 of 1639 (778419)
02-20-2016 12:09 AM


Nomination for PC post of the thread
I would like to nominate Theodoric's Message 729 as the most perfect example of PC in this discussion, an exquisite example of ad hominem paranoid reasoning, psychoanalyzing your opponent, inventing motives for your opponent in order to attack them, completely ignoring the substance of the discussion in favor of emotion-mongering propaganda revolving around the classic PC terms "hate" and "hypocrisy." A blue ribbon post. It was close of course since there are many good examples of PC on the thread.
And the winner is:
Faith's responses and arguments have solidified a few I have had for a while. Many of the people on the religious right do not follow the people they do because they embody or articulate the religious view they hold. The support for Donald Trump completely destroys this idea. They follow the people they do because they feel it gives them some sort of moral cover for the hate they have. Donald Trump's followers expose the hypocrisy and hate of the religious right movement. They can make all the high moral claims they want , but the tortured reasoning they use just continues to expose them for haters and hypocrites.
Faith is a prime example.

Replies to this message:
 Message 797 by NoNukes, posted 02-20-2016 12:40 AM Faith has not replied
 Message 814 by Dr Adequate, posted 02-20-2016 9:21 AM Faith has replied

  
Genomicus
Member (Idle past 1971 days)
Posts: 852
Joined: 02-15-2012


(2)
Message 794 of 1639 (778420)
02-20-2016 12:13 AM
Reply to: Message 788 by Faith
02-19-2016 11:43 PM


Re: immigration and incarceration
The real offense is to refer to illegal immigrants as "undocumented" which pretends they are in some sense legal...
Derp. They are legal. They are legal persons. Maybe you should consider studying a bit of civil law before commenting on this.
Meanwhile, "undocumented" refers to their actual status in the United State.
...which is a PC lie that has been picked up by the media and shoved down our throats along with all the rest of the PC program to undermine the nation.
Utter nonsense. You keep harping on and on about "PC" when this isn't about subscribing to some vague PC perspective. This is about seeing the world without your lenses colored by a racist and xenophobic ideology.
The difference in the terms doesn't mean a lot to me.
Kewl story, brah, but the difference in terms sure means a lot to undocumented immigrants who are beaten by Trump supporters who view them as illegal persons.
Hey I'm happy there are success stories like that and I'm all for doing something for them somehow or other...
Like what? Call them "illegal" when they are perfectly legal persons? Vote for a GOP candidate who wants to deport them?
...but illegal entry into the country is illegal no matter how you spin it, and declaring illegality legal is mind rape.
It's a civil offense, not a criminal offense. Unlike rape. Let me see. Do you call someone who fails to pay rent on time "illegals" (that's a civil offense, not a criminal one)? Or do you view them far more holistically, treating them as individuals instead of lumps of people?
Edited by Genomicus, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 788 by Faith, posted 02-19-2016 11:43 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 795 by Faith, posted 02-20-2016 12:16 AM Genomicus has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 795 of 1639 (778421)
02-20-2016 12:16 AM
Reply to: Message 794 by Genomicus
02-20-2016 12:13 AM


Oops, here comes the runner-up
Ha ha ha. What a nice example of leftist mind-bending word magic. Deserves Runner-Up to Theodoric's Perfect PC.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 794 by Genomicus, posted 02-20-2016 12:13 AM Genomicus has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 799 by Genomicus, posted 02-20-2016 12:45 AM Faith has replied

  
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