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Author Topic:   Oh No, The New Awesome Primary Thread
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 977 of 1639 (778681)
02-23-2016 11:39 AM
Reply to: Message 976 by JonF
02-23-2016 11:36 AM


Re: Not POWs just terrorists
That's what I quoted. Nobody bothered to read it?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 976 by JonF, posted 02-23-2016 11:36 AM JonF has replied

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 980 of 1639 (778691)
02-23-2016 12:54 PM
Reply to: Message 979 by NoNukes
02-23-2016 12:49 PM


You obviously mjsunderstood what I've said, or you are outright lying, though I won't say I believe you are, when you say I ever accepted your interpretation of the "rapists" remark. Sorry, you're wrong.
And what's with this "illegal persons" nonsense? Just another underhanded accusation I guess. I've never said anything other than "illegal immigrants."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 979 by NoNukes, posted 02-23-2016 12:49 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 985 of 1639 (778704)
02-23-2016 2:51 PM
Reply to: Message 984 by Aussie
02-23-2016 2:01 PM


Re: gay marriage
Seems nobody wants Christian law any more, Sharia sounds better to you.
In any case I believe whatever God says is worthy of death is worthy of death, and there are plenty of sins that describes, sins most of us have committed. Haven't we already discussed this? We don't put people to death for anything but murder any more.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 989 of 1639 (778712)
02-23-2016 3:48 PM
Reply to: Message 988 by NoNukes
02-23-2016 3:40 PM


"Most?" You're an accuser like all the rest here. Not a shred of benefit of the doubt.,

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 998 of 1639 (778733)
02-23-2016 9:21 PM
Reply to: Message 997 by jar
02-23-2016 8:00 PM


Re: even terrorists when caught deserve a fair trial.
All the opinion about this madeup incident is coming from current PC leftists who have an amazing inability to distinguish terrorists from innocents. It would be more convincing if we had some information about the legal matters involved from the time of Pershing.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 997 by jar, posted 02-23-2016 8:00 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 999 by jar, posted 02-23-2016 9:57 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 1001 by JonF, posted 02-23-2016 10:04 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 1002 by Dr Adequate, posted 02-23-2016 10:06 PM Faith has replied
 Message 1021 by ringo, posted 02-24-2016 10:54 AM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1003 of 1639 (778740)
02-23-2016 11:32 PM
Reply to: Message 1002 by Dr Adequate
02-23-2016 10:06 PM


Re: even terrorists when caught deserve a fair trial.
Sad to keep discovering that leftists really do have some sort of mental problem that makes it impossible for them to follow the topic.
The fact that the story is probably fiction has been acknowledged by me I don't know how many times in this thread so far and yet you all keep talking as if that's what we're talking about. Well, I'm not and haven't been, except to try to stitch up the mental problem, which hasn't been working.
No, the subject is the heinous nature of executing Muslims caught in the act of mass murder -- THAT is what it would be interesting to know the legality of in Pershing's time, even if the story is fiction. Because that is Trump's supposed moral failing, fiction or not.
Perhaps if you all have a good vitamin-protein drink before you post on the subject again?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1002 by Dr Adequate, posted 02-23-2016 10:06 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1004 by jar, posted 02-23-2016 11:34 PM Faith has replied
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1005 of 1639 (778742)
02-23-2016 11:40 PM
Reply to: Message 1004 by jar
02-23-2016 11:34 PM


Re: even terrorists when caught deserve a fair trial.
Trump was using it as an example of proper behavior and THAT is why he is and should be condemned.
Gosh, jar, get a good night's sleep and have a heavy-duty vitamin drink and strong coffee when you get up before you try again.
The assessment of "proper behavior" on this thread has been given according to current leftist PC, as I said, which is what prompted me to wonder what the assessment of proper behavior might have been in Pershing's time. Fiction or not the question of proper behavior relates to his time and not ours. A couple dozen or more posts have been wasted on irrelevancies since then. But I'd still like to know the answer.
Make that a really bracing cup of coffee.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1007 of 1639 (778744)
02-24-2016 12:48 AM
Reply to: Message 1006 by Dr Adequate
02-24-2016 12:07 AM


Re: even terrorists when caught deserve a fair trial.
Remarkable. Endless excuses for missing the point.
Yes I don't want to do the research myself. And I don't even really care if nobody else does either, it's just that I know there are much better researchers here than I'll ever be and research tires me out. But it would be nice if the task were at least understood.
But alas the ways that can be found for evading the topic are legion.
You want a real scenario but all we have is a fictional one, but there is no lack of detail from which to construct a putative reality that could be assessed by the real standards of Pershing's time. Except that for some reason you prefer to evade the task and keep on producing endless irrelevant posts.
Oh well. I guess I can keep up the game too if I have to. For a while anyway.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1006 by Dr Adequate, posted 02-24-2016 12:07 AM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


(1)
Message 1009 of 1639 (778747)
02-24-2016 1:25 AM
Reply to: Message 1008 by Dr Adequate
02-24-2016 12:57 AM


No, it is not at all clear that terrorists when caught deserve a fair trial.
There is enough information to go on of course in the scenario you claim is not detailed enough.
Anyway: This is a hard subject to research as I expected. I want to know how laws dealing with enemies may be different since Pershing's time. Googling various aspects of the issue gets one into the Geneva Conventions and their applicability to various situations. Such as:
The Heritage Foundation | The Heritage Foundation
It defines what a POW is in such a way as to suggest there are captured enemies who aren't considered POWs, but pinning it down eludes me so far. Military trials are the rule, certainly NOT trial by US civilian courts. And there are some hostile entities who are not entitled to its protections:
Parties to the Conventions enjoy protections if they follow their rules. Entities that are not party to the Conventions, by definition, may be denied the privileges extended to parties to the Conventions.
In addition to the treaty ratification requirements, Article 4 of the Third Geneva Convention protects prisoners of war if the combatant satisfies four additional pre-conditions. To enjoy the protections of the Convention as a prisoner of war (POW), a combatant must satisfy four conditions:
1. Be commanded by a person responsible for his subordinates;
2. Have a fixed distinctive sign recognizable at a distance;
3. Carry any weapons openly; and
4. Conduct operations in accordance with the laws and customs of war.
So I have no idea whether IF Pershing did execute some Muslims on the spot where they murdered a whole village that would have been a violation of anything having to do with the Geneva convention or general humane rules of combat. For a recent example, seems to me a lot of Muslim killings don't fit the conditions listed above. What that means about how they are to be treated would take a lot more study -- I should say how they WERE to be treated in Pershing's time.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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 Message 1022 by Theodoric, posted 02-24-2016 11:31 AM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1028 of 1639 (778795)
02-24-2016 12:15 PM
Reply to: Message 1013 by Pressie
02-24-2016 6:47 AM


Re: No, it is not at all clear that terrorists when caught deserve a fair trial.
NoNukes, remember you're trying to argue with someone who thinks that it's Okie Dokie to own slaves.
Are you talking about me? If so you'd better come up with some evidence because that's a big fat lie you just told.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1029 of 1639 (778798)
02-24-2016 12:40 PM
Reply to: Message 1022 by Theodoric
02-24-2016 11:31 AM


Re: No, it is not at all clear that terrorists when caught deserve a fair trial.
Thank you for the information. I generally avoid Snopes because I know it has a liberal slant. However, that was a very thorough discussion of relevant facts. So thanks.
What it succeeds in proving at least is that the pigs blood story Trump told has a lot of history behind it and was not made up by Trump or made up recently at all, even if they were unable to track down reports of an incident sufficiently like the one Trump reported to support his claim.
But what is reported nevertheless gives quite a bit of support to what he said, which flies in the face of all the claims here that he just made it up or there was nothing to the story at all.
It also does suggest that it is or was not unheard of for hostile entities to be executed without trial, and apparently legally. The different situations mentioned include one of Muslims / Moros being executed without trial, though Pershing regretted it -- not on legal grounds apparently but just because he sincerely wanted to avoid killings if possible.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1059 of 1639 (778939)
02-26-2016 10:42 PM
Reply to: Message 1058 by Dr Adequate
02-26-2016 9:59 PM


Yes, we'd certainly like to be freed of the prohibition on political speech, but Trump did deal us a low blow on another front when he said he wouldn't support Israel.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1061 of 1639 (778942)
02-27-2016 12:39 AM
Reply to: Message 1060 by Dr Adequate
02-27-2016 12:23 AM


...unless the church wants to keep its tax-exempt status. Did I really have to add that?

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


(1)
Message 1063 of 1639 (778945)
02-27-2016 1:14 AM
Reply to: Message 1062 by Dr Adequate
02-27-2016 12:45 AM


You do know that churches always used to be tax-exempt just because they were churches, right? And since preaching on the culture, including preaching on politics, is standard Christian work, there was never any legal problem until the 501c3 government intrusion into the business of the church was laid on it. Personally I'm with those who think the church should reject anything the government imposes on it that makes it answerable to the government in any way at all, so in this brave new pagan world that wants us to disappear I think we should just give it up completely. However, if Trump gets the Presidency and wants to remove that restriction, terrific.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1069 of 1639 (778958)
02-27-2016 11:24 AM
Reply to: Message 1068 by Dr Adequate
02-27-2016 10:50 AM


Trump has been married too many times but I'm not aware that he's cheated on his wife as Clinton did, but then I don't claim to be up on it all, so please show me how this cartoon is justified.

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