Free will vs Omniscience

Sorry but now you are just posting more nonsense even by any standards as well as continuing to misrepresent what I have said.I did not say or imply that the thread was nonsense, only that your posts have been utter nonsense as well as totally dishonest.It really is that simple.

Again, what does that have to do with the topic Phat?And the RC Sproul quote at best shows his ignorance and more likely shows his carny con man tactics.

As folk have been saying all along Faith, you don't believe in the Bible or what the Bible actually says but rather what the "theologians" you trust claim the Bible actually says.AbE:You trust the fiction those theologians create like (there are no contradictions in the Bible) or (there are no errors and falsehoods in the Bible) rather than what is actually written even when what they say directly contradicts what the Bible actually says.Edited by jar, : see AbE:

More utter nonsense.It is not a matter of interpretation or understanding, it is a matter of honesty. It is a matter of actually believing that what is written in the Bible is what is written in the Bible. Yet it does often contradict itself and is filled with stuff that is factually false.

Except the R.C. Sproul quote you use has absolutely nothing to do with understanding the Bible but rather Sproul's ignorance of science. Look at the quote:

quote:

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Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul

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First science does not assert that there is some force called chance.Second, chance does have a basis in reality and can be demonstrated.Such things are only mythologized in religion. Again, you need to stop misrepresenting my position Phat; you never seem to get it right.There is a third element that you leave out; the trinity consists of logic, reason and reality.And if I do leave folk with more questions then I am succeeding. You can only learn when you question the answers you have been given. Yet you can never show how people can learn about God other than by blindly believing the utter nonsense answers they are sold. But the evidence shows that there is a huge number of hucksters and snake oil salesmen selling Jesus Christ and other products. So you are saying that the Calvinists are all just hucksters? You are saying that God is not omniscient?

What we know has nothing to do with whether or not a God that has foreknowledge yet creates beings known to be doomed is evil. Open Theism is just another Carny sideshow, "Come see the Tattooed Lady, the two headed snake and the Man from Borneo". It is certainly less evil than Calvinism but still totally misses the Gospel which is really simple; "Do your best."

There was someone else, I think his name was Jesus. It is recorded in a book called the Bible. Maybe you should read it sometime. Shall I go on Phat?Jesus says we should try to feed the hungry, comfort the sorrowful, cloth the naked, teach the children, heal the sick.Granted the version you like is certainly easier and a much easier thing to sell the gullible.

But I am not a Gandhian or a moderate Muslim and to call myself either would simply be a lie. But I have never said there was nothing more; what I have said is that Jesus said the important job for us is to try to do. That is paramount.Most of the other things as you point out were creations of those who were creating and marketing a new product; Christianity. And I have never disputed that the folk creating Christianity (at least those who were creating the surviving chapters of Club Christian) believed those things. But those things are not what Jesus taught or Jesus mission or Jesus ministry.

But I have never claimed that they were Christians so what is your point? Again, unless you can provide specifics I cannot even fathom what point you are trying to make. There is a whole thread where I asked Christians "What is Christianity" and beyond membership in a Chapter that identifies itself as part of Club Christian or just self identification as a Christian, there were no universal features unique to Christianity. People follow folk who are delusional all the time.But there are good reasons as well. I look at the teachings of Jesus that relate to how one lives his life and his relationship with others and the universe and they seem a good path to follow. I would likely feel the same if I had been raised in a Jewish or Taoist or Atheist or Agnostic or Muslim or Buddhist family.Even if everything said about Jesus was a fabrication, those lessons have worth and value.But I was raised in a Christian family, educated in a Christian school and joined a Chapter of Club Christian so I am a Christian.

Not true as usual.Stop trying to make my beliefs fit on a bumper sticker.It really is that simple. I have no idea of what would make me right with God but the Bible and the words attributed to Jesus sure in hell tell us what would get us on God's wrong side.

I would tend to agree that many if not most Christians, particularly "Biblical" and "Evangelical" Christians do fuck both God and Jesus.

No, what you do is only evidence of what you do and not evidence for what Spirit is within us.

That is not what God said; in fact God said that we were mature enough to be gods.Have you ever read the Bible Phat?

The evidence shows that you and so many others are as ignorant about reality as you are about history, the Bible, Christianity and almost every other subject. Humanity has certainly controlled war and in just the last half century. There are fewer wars today than at any time in history and the wars that do happen lead to fewer casualties, both military and civilian than in any previous war. And lying, cheating and stealing are human caused. Jesus or God will not stop them, never has and never will. The same is true of greed. Only humans can stop lying, cheating, stealing or greed. And the evidence shows it is those people like you who are shirking, denying that responsibility; those that claim to submit to some creator, who count on anyone other than themselves to take responsibility to fix what is wrong.The answer really is simple.Don't lie.Don't cheat.Don't steal.Take personal responsibility for all you do.

You did not created NoNukes nor do you have the power to condemn NoNukes to hell.